Pats FA thread

If BB believes he is plan A and our Qb for the next 5 years than give up 15. I don't want that but I am all in to upgrade the position. BB believes Jimmy is an upgrade and a significant one. Fire the bullet and go get him. $25 mil is not a lot for a starter QB you believe can win.

We just got all those FAs who will flounder with Cam. Jimmy will run the offense the way it's supposed to be run.
For 4-6 games. Then its Cam again.
 
If BB believes he is plan A and our Qb for the next 5 years than give up 15. I don't want that but I am all in to upgrade the position. BB believes Jimmy is an upgrade and a significant one. Fire the bullet and go get him. $25 mil is not a lot for a starter QB you believe can win.

We just got all those FAs who will flounder with Cam. Jimmy will run the offense the way it's supposed to be run.

Link for this?

Cam's accomplished far more in this league than JimmyG has and Cam is only 1.5 years older than JG.
You're convinced JG is the answer. We get that.
What you're not seeing is JG's injury history, the capital cost to acquire him, his contract and his passing stats.
Think about this..why does Shanahan want to replace him?
 
Link for this?

Cam's accomplished far more in this league than JimmyG has and Cam is only 1.5 years older than JG.
You're convinced JG is the answer. We get that.
What you're not seeing is JG's injury history, the capital cost to acquire him, his contract and his passing stats.
Think about this..why does Shanahan want to replace him?
That is a great question.
 
Link for this?

Cam's accomplished far more in this league than JimmyG has and Cam is only 1.5 years older than JG.
You're convinced JG is the answer. We get that.
What you're not seeing is JG's injury history, the capital cost to acquire him, his contract and his passing stats.
Think about this..why does Shanahan want to replace him?

Because he had to figure out who else to start 33 times when Jimmy was out.

The big question is whether his injuries have just been a run of really bad luck and could be healthy for the next 5 seasons or is he really made of glass? I hate that expression. I think it's often used unfairly, though I'm not sure it doesn't apply here.

I'm probably in the pro-JimmyG camp since every time I watch the guy he tends to play really well. I'm not convinced that he gets enough credit for his ability, which to me is considerable and legitimate. He was deadly versus us last year and I couldn't help but wonder what would have happened had we hung onto him. However, that game was such a savage beating that I'm sure we all entertained dark thoughts. We aren't used to stuff like that. Or weren't.

Having said all that, I really don't want to give up 15 for him and roll the dice. I think the organization is keenly aware of what can happen when you miss on
key draft picks, particularly over a couple of years and I think there will be a serious desire to pick a couple of future stars and keep the momentum rolling. Maybe even some that don't go on IR very often.

I think the JimmyG ship has sailed and we shouldn't risk a first for him, but if it happened then I could be talked into feeling positive about it.
 
It’s not that BB did bad this FA period. He had to make those moves, and they will keep the team around .500

It’s that it’s average. It’s not going to get this team to win the division, or a playoff game by itself. He’s got to knock the next two drafts out of the park to get this team back in contention.

Y’all are joking about him collecting 40 JAG LBs and safeties. I don’t think it’s funny. The offense is going to average about 18 to 21 points a game next year. Cam is so bad your not even going to be able to develop skill players in the system your running with him.
Troll.
 
Link for this?

Cam's accomplished far more in this league than JimmyG has and Cam is only 1.5 years older than JG.
You're convinced JG is the answer. We get that.
What you're not seeing is JG's injury history, the capital cost to acquire him, his contract and his passing stats.
Think about this..why does Shanahan want to replace him?

Your comments about the ages of Newton and Garoppolo made me start to wonder about the ages of Super Bowl winning QBs.

The current thinking is to try to draft a young stud coming out of college and win a Super Bowl while he's still on his first contract.

But the data doesn't support that strategy so much as it supports getting an older QB.

I put together a chart that shows the age of each Super Bowl winning QB.

1617606321942.png

Very few QBs win a title when they're 25 or younger. The average age of the Super Bowl winning QB is a little bit over 30, and the median is 29. So if your QB is 30 or over he's just a likely to win a Super Bowl as someone who is on the right side of 30.

(The X-axis displays the number of the Super Bowl, and the Y-axis displays the age of the QB.)
 
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Your comments about the ages of Newton and Garoppolo made me start to wonder about the ages of Super Bowl winning QBs.

The current thinking is to try to draft a young stud coming out of college and win a Super Bowl while he's still on his first contract.

But the data doesn't support that strategy so much as it supports getting an older QB.

I put together a chart that shows the age of each Super Bowl winning QB.

View attachment 3045

Very few QBs win a title when they're 25 or younger. The average age of the Super Bowl winning QB is a little bit over 30, and the median is 29. So if your QB is 30 or over he's just a likely to win a Super Bowl as someone who is on the right side of 30.

(The X-axis displays the number of the Super Bowl, and the Y-axis displays the age of the QB.)

Another way of looking at it - how many QBs won a SB after changing teams (Plunkett, Hostetler, Brad Johnson, Doug Williams, Warner, Foles, Dilfer, Manning and Brady off the top of my head) and how many won with their original teams? The secret, I think, is drafting and developing the right guy and then holding on to him for those SB runs. But that's not the only way to get there as the list of QBs who won after changing teams shows.
 
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Because he had to figure out who else to start 33 times when Jimmy was out.

The big question is whether his injuries have just been a run of really bad luck and could be healthy for the next 5 seasons or is he really made of glass? I hate that expression. I think it's often used unfairly, though I'm not sure it doesn't apply here.

I'm probably in the pro-JimmyG camp since every time I watch the guy he tends to play really well. I'm not convinced that he gets enough credit for his ability, which to me is considerable and legitimate. He was deadly versus us last year and I couldn't help but wonder what would have happened had we hung onto him. However, that game was such a savage beating that I'm sure we all entertained dark thoughts. We aren't used to stuff like that. Or weren't.

Having said all that, I really don't want to give up 15 for him and roll the dice. I think the organization is keenly aware of what can happen when you miss on
key draft picks, particularly over a couple of years and I think there will be a serious desire to pick a couple of future stars and keep the momentum rolling. Maybe even some that don't go on IR very often.

I think the JimmyG ship has sailed and we shouldn't risk a first for him, but if it happened then I could be talked into feeling positive about it.
Exactly how I feel too Hawg. I don't want to give up 15 for him but I do believe he would be a legit upgrade and we could really contend this season with him.

I could also be talked into it being positive as we have had some first round busts and the league has also taken some from us. Spending a top pick on the most important position AND for a guy you had for 3.5 years who you were grooming to replace Brady seems like really good business to me.
 
I don’t think I’ve seen Jimmy play in a cold bad weather game, and I’m not sure he’s the QB I’d want in one. I guess though they beat Green Bay on the way to the super bowl, but I can’t remember where that one was played.
Saying that collectively this group of free agent signings is average is not being a troll by the way.
 
Because he had to figure out who else to start 33 times when Jimmy was out.

The big question is whether his injuries have just been a run of really bad luck and could be healthy for the next 5 seasons or is he really made of glass? I hate that expression. I think it's often used unfairly, though I'm not sure it doesn't apply here.

I'm probably in the pro-JimmyG camp since every time I watch the guy he tends to play really well. I'm not convinced that he gets enough credit for his ability, which to me is considerable and legitimate. He was deadly versus us last year and I couldn't help but wonder what would have happened had we hung onto him. However, that game was such a savage beating that I'm sure we all entertained dark thoughts. We aren't used to stuff like that. Or weren't.

Having said all that, I really don't want to give up 15 for him and roll the dice. I think the organization is keenly aware of what can happen when you miss on
key draft picks, particularly over a couple of years and I think there will be a serious desire to pick a couple of future stars and keep the momentum rolling. Maybe even some that don't go on IR very often.

I think the JimmyG ship has sailed and we shouldn't risk a first for him, but if it happened then I could be talked into feeling positive about it.

I don't like the 'injury prone' moniker either unless it's the same injury or same type of injury that keeps occurring. In Jimmy's case, all his injuries have been ligament injuries. That leads me to believe there could be a genetic weakness with his ligaments and an argument could easily be made that he is actually 'injury prone'.
 
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Another way of looking at it - how many QBs won a SB after changing teams (Plunkett, Hostetler, Brad Johnson, Doug Williams, Warner, Foles, Dilfer, Manning and Brady off the top of my head) and how many won with their original teams?

There's a few others:
  • Favre started out with Falcons
  • Brees started out with the Chargers
  • Len Dawson was on a few teams prior to the Chiefs
  • Unitas was drafted by the Steelers but was cut
  • Eli Manning was drafted by the Chargers but was traded on draft day
 
There's a few others:
  • Favre started out with Falcons
  • Brees started out with the Chargers
  • Len Dawson was on a few teams prior to the Chiefs
  • Unitas was drafted by the Steelers but was cut
  • Eli Manning was drafted by the Chargers but was traded on draft day

I forgot about Brees but had no recollection of Favre and Unitas (cut by the Steelers!)
Thanks, TR
 
To me if BB really wants JG, then it doesn't matter what pick.he trades for him except #15. I'd rather see the Patriots draft Jones or Lance, even if it means trading up.
But if they can't trade up, I'd rather see them trade down, then use a 2nd or 3rd for JG.
If SF insists on a first round pick for JG, then they can go pound sand.
His work since we traded him does not warrant a 1st rounder. If it did SF would not move up to take a QB, they would stick with him.
 
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I forgot about Brees but had no recollection of Favre and Unitas (cut by the Steelers!)
Thanks, TR
Another way to slice the onion is to notice that there are a lot of QBs that have won multiple Super Bowls.

In fact, 34 of the 55 Super Bowls have been won by QBs that have won two or more.

1617629476193.png

Once a QB wins a championship, there's a pretty good chance that he's going to win another one.

It's not a given, of course. It's kind of surprising that some QBs that are very high on the all-time passing lists only have one championship - I'm thinking Favre and Brees here. It looks like Rodgers may be get the "big-stats, one ring" label too.
 
I don’t think I’ve seen Jimmy play in a cold bad weather game, and I’m not sure he’s the QB I’d want in one. I guess though they beat Green Bay on the way to the super bowl, but I can’t remember where that one was played.
Saying that collectively this group of free agent signings is average is not being a troll by the way.

Maybe not a "troll". I'm sure I could come up with a kinder, gentler description of somebody that could, for instance, look at adding 191 catches and 22 TDs and several excellent perimeter blockers (a big 2020 weakness) to the receiving corps as "average".

How 'bout a Miserable Contrarian?

I could agree with somebody who said we could've done a little better than Agholor and Bourne for the money, but both make us better. However, how anybody could look at Henry and Jonnu as "average" just makes me shake my head in amazement. I didn't even bother throwing in 3 more names that are all-pro quality.

It might be one of the top FA hauls in the last 20 years. What the fuck do people unhappy with that want?
 
What the fuck do people unhappy with that want?
All the same pickups, plus maybe 30 million in cap left over and a dozen or so draft picks already lined up for 2022?

Cheers
 
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