Arizona Teacher Makes Students Be Chivalrous

[SteelerFan87]

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Type Size: A A APrintEmailRetweet Digg this.Gilbert teacher has students work on their manners
12 commentsby Lisa Nicita - Sept. 7, 2009 01:00 PM
Special for the Republic .
Elise Rierson didn't think much of her restroom request during her third-year Latin class shortly after school began this year at Gilbert Classical Academy.

She didn't think about it until she stood from her desk, only to see every boy in the class stand along with her as she walked out of the classroom.

They were supposed to.
The nostalgic courtesy is part of this year's curriculum. Latin Chair Cord Ivanyi wanted his students to learn and practice the art of manners.

Still, it was a little embarrassing.

"It's kind of weird when they're doing it, but I forget about it afterwards," Rierson, 14, said of the boys' reaction. "It's just kind of a natural thing now."

That's what Ivanyi had hoped for.

He had a feeling his push for manners and etiquette would at first be met by his teenage students with giggles and snickers, but he had hoped it would become second nature.

Ivanyi announced the initiative on the first day of class:


• Boys would hold doors for girls.


• They would ask girls if they would like to be seated, and offer to take their backpacks before they sit down.


• Boys would stand if a girl leaves the room.


• They would allow girls to be served first if food is in the classroom.


• And, girls always had the right of refusal.

"All boys will understand chivalry," Ivanyi said. "It's teaching them social grace. It's things they should know when they do go out on dates."

Ivanyi introduced the idea to one of his afternoon classes last year because they were "juvenile and disorganized."

He thought a little structure would center them. Ivanyi decided to introduce it to all of his Latin classes this year.

Brian Rosta, principal at Gilbert Classical Academy, said he fully supports Ivanyi's push for etiquette.

"The girls absolutely love it," Rosta said.

At times, courtesy turned into a bit of a competition.

Boys were rushing to seat certain girls. Some girls wanted to be seated by certain boys. And, boys were jumping from their seats to be the first one standing when a girl left the room.

Most of that has ended. The novelty has worn off.

Now, Ivanyi is hearing that the habits are spreading.

Rierson said she is noticing that more boys are holding doors for girls throughout the school.

"It won't ever be something that's bad for them," Ivanyi said of both the boys and the girls. "They're (the girls) taking away from it that it's not bad to be treated gently. They're used to competing like wild animals for the same resources."

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2009/09/07/20090907gr-manners0909.html

The article is from last year, but for some reason it's being talked about now. :shrug:

Anyway, I'm all for chivalry and being nice to girls, but I have some problems with this.
1. Are there rules for the girls too? If not, the boys are being taken advantage of. Do the girls have to behave as they would have been expected to at the time these chivalrous rules were followed? Or do they just have boys waiting on them hand and foot at all times? If the boys have to treat the girls like queens without there being any comparable rules for girls, it's unfair and I'm surprised no one has challenged this.

2. Opening doors, ok. Pulling chairs out, ok. Offering to hold books or bookbags, ok. Letting the girls be served food first, eh maybe. But making every boy stand any time a girl leaves the room (or, I presume, enters)? That's rather much. And really, I think, takes this from being nice to girls, to being reverent to them.

3. I understand the teacher did this because he saw boys pushing girls out of the way and stuff. And in that context I would think it's fine that he made those boys act like this to teach them a lesson. But apparently he instituted this rule at the beginning of the next school year, so he wasn't even dealing with the same disrespectful kids. And it apparently lasted the whole year, which even if it was the same kids, would be too long to be an appropriate punishment.

4. You're instituting an element of courtship to a class of young teenagers. The article mentions competition, with boys trying to be the first to act chivalrously (obviously to impress the girls), boys wanting to seat certain girls, girls wanting to be seated by certain boys, etc. Do I even have to say why this is a bad idea? Competition for the affection of a girl or boy you like already causes enough strife and anxiety in schools, especially at that age. What do the girls who don't have alot of boys rushing to seat them feel like? What do the boys who actually get turned down by girls who only want a certain boy to seat them feel like? Why bring that into the classroom?

 

[mgoblue101415]

Girls are fragile, treat them gently.


Manners are one thing. A trip back in time is something entirely different. You should treat everyone with good manners, not just men towards women.


And like hell it won't be something that will ever be bad for them. I'm not the only woman out there who would not go on a second date with a guy who opened every door for me, stood up every time I got up from the table, waited for me to sit first, etc. An entire evening of that would make me sick. There's no way in hell I would go out with that guy again. Opening a door or two is great, but what this guy is teaching is just over the fricken top. And that goes the other way, as well. These girls are going to expect that crap and are in for a rude awakening when guys they date down the road don't treat them that way.

Congrats to this guy for keeping sexism and inequality alive and kicking.


What's on the agenda for next year... Teaching the girls how to be an obedient and dutiful wife?

 

[pray4mojo]

Big Ben could use a summer session at this academy.

 

[Number Cruncher]

The article is from last year, but for some reason it's being talked about now. :shrug:

Anyway, I'm all for chivalry and being nice to girls, but I have some problems with this.

Shocker

1. Are there rules for the girls too? If not, the boys are being taken advantage of. Do the girls have to behave as they would have been expected to at the time these chivalrous rules were followed? Or do they just have boys waiting on them hand and foot at all times? If the boys have to treat the girls like queens without there being any comparable rules for girls, it's unfair and I'm surprised no one has challenged this.

I'm surprised someone would dig up a six month old article and then write a 2000 word complaint about it, disecting it more than the Zapruder film.

2. Opening doors, ok. Pulling chairs out, ok. Offering to hold books or bookbags, ok. Letting the girls be served food first, eh maybe. But making every boy stand any time a girl leaves the room (or, I presume, enters)? That's rather much. And really, I think, takes this from being nice to girls, to being reverent to them.

They should only stand if they are then going to follow them into the ladies room?

3. I understand the teacher did this because he saw boys pushing girls out of the way and stuff. And in that context I would think it's fine that he made those boys act like this to teach them a lesson. But apparently he instituted this rule at the beginning of the next school year, so he wasn't even dealing with the same disrespectful kids. And it apparently lasted the whole year, which even if it was the same kids, would be too long to be an appropriate punishment.

Only you think this is punishment.

4. You're instituting an element of courtship to a class of young teenagers. The article mentions competition, with boys trying to be the first to act chivalrously (obviously to impress the girls), boys wanting to seat certain girls, girls wanting to be seated by certain boys, etc. Do I even have to say why this is a bad idea? Competition for the affection of a girl or boy you like already causes enough strife and anxiety in schools, especially at that age. What do the girls who don't have alot of boys rushing to seat them feel like? What do the boys who actually get turned down by girls who only want a certain boy to seat them feel like? Why bring that into the classroom?

Yes, we would all be better served to keep this out of the classroom and into the small college bars in out of the way little towns in Georgia.

 

[mikiemo83]

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2009/09/07/20090907gr-manners0909.html

The article is from last year, but for some reason it's being talked about now. :shrug:

Anyway, I'm all for chivalry and being nice to girls, but I have some problems with this.
1. Are there rules for the girls too? If not, the boys are being taken advantage of. Do the girls have to behave as they would have been expected to at the time these chivalrous rules were followed? Or do they just have boys waiting on them hand and foot at all times? If the boys have to treat the girls like queens without there being any comparable rules for girls, it's unfair and I'm surprised no one has challenged this.

they are not being taken advantage of, they are learning Manners and what they get back in return is ten fold

they will now hold the door for a woman at a grocery store, they will offer to take someones bags and walk them to their car, they will carry these manners with them for the rest of their lives, they will take steps to become model citizens not some punk ass puke only looking out for number 1 acting like a douche because they need theirs.

2. Opening doors, ok. Pulling chairs out, ok. Offering to hold books or bookbags, ok. Letting the girls be served food first, eh maybe. But making every boy stand any time a girl leaves the room (or, I presume, enters)? That's rather much. And really, I think, takes this from being nice to girls, to being reverent to them.

these kids will get laid before you, want to know why? they treat a woman right, not as an object of lust but with respect...they are not worrying about what to do with the hot chick in the library because they opened the door for her, broke the ice and moved into the 'that's sweet' zone....which leads to the nookie zone not the friend zone

3. I understand the teacher did this because he saw boys pushing girls out of the way and stuff. And in that context I would think it's fine that he made those boys act like this to teach them a lesson. But apparently he instituted this rule at the beginning of the next school year, so he wasn't even dealing with the same disrespectful kids. And it apparently lasted the whole year, which even if it was the same kids, would be too long to be an appropriate punishment.

maybe he saw teh benefits of it with the 1st group, how with the new manners came less classroom disruptions and a better learning environment where the 'little shit stuff' didn't exist in his class and it was all about learning

4. You're instituting an element of courtship to a class of young teenagers. The article mentions competition, with boys trying to be the first to act chivalrously (obviously to impress the girls), boys wanting to seat certain girls, girls wanting to be seated by certain boys, etc. Do I even have to say why this is a bad idea? Competition for the affection of a girl or boy you like already causes enough strife and anxiety in schools, especially at that age. What do the girls who don't have alot of boys rushing to seat them feel like? What do the boys who actually get turned down by girls who only want a certain boy to seat them feel like? Why bring that into the classroom?

it is a way for a kid who wouldn't talk to a certain girl in class to actually break the ice, maybe they get to know each other a bit, make small talk. Maybe this leads to her changing a preconceived opinion of him and he scores her affection

I learned that you become more attractive to a woman if you do the things he suggest, talk to them but mostly pay attention to their words, get them to smile while you make them laugh and give them a feeling of security with you - these new manners go far in developing those traits and in the end it lands you a fish so far out of your league your head spins

 

[cka203]

For the record, I'm in love with Mikie! :heart:

Listen, I'm all for equality. But I also believe in manners. I hold doors open for men, when given the opportunity. I just believe it's the polite thing to do. And when a man holds the door open for me, I am not offended - I thank them.

:shrug:

 

[PatsFan09]

Latin teachers truly are geniuses.

 

[TipRoast]

Latin teachers truly are geniuses.

Veritas.

 

[mikiemo83]

Girls are fragile, treat them gently.


Manners are one thing. A trip back in time is something entirely different. You should treat everyone with good manners, not just men towards women.


And like hell it won't be something that will ever be bad for them. I'm not the only woman out there who would not go on a second date with a guy who opened every door for me, stood up every time I got up from the table, waited for me to sit first, etc. An entire evening of that would make me sick. There's no way in hell I would go out with that guy again. Opening a door or two is great, but what this guy is teaching is just over the fricken top. And that goes the other way, as well. These girls are going to expect that crap and are in for a rude awakening when guys they date down the road don't treat them that way.

Congrats to this guy for keeping sexism and inequality alive and kicking.


What's on the agenda for next year... Teaching the girls how to be an obedient and dutiful wife?

the manners will be tempered as they leave his class, the up and down will slowly evolve into seating her 1st, the holding Doors will remain but is that a bad thing? I do not see it as sexist just allowing them to walk into the room 1st and get the attention the they deserve in that lovely ensemble she picked out for the evening.


I am sure that these girls are not expecting that from every male they meet because the other classes are not following this teacher lead.

Women's Equality, something I believe in, would be brought forward if every attempt to do something polite was not called out as an attempt to hold a woman back. Equality can exist while a door is being held open for you

 

[babalu87]

Do the laundry
Fetch my paper and slippers
Cook my dinner
Bake me some fvcking pie

SF87

 

[tommysgirl]

What is wrong with this? Have you seen how teenage boys act now????

When my oldest was in 8th grade, I was giving his girlfriend a ride home from school. He opened her car door for her and she looked at him like he had three heads because nobody had ever done that before. That is absurd and I felt bad for her.

My kids may not be perfect but I would be absolutely STUNNED if they were not polite and did the little things like opening doors, carrying bags etc......it is the right thing to do.

FT won't allow me to carry bags or anything unless his arms are absolutely packed and can't carry anymore and even then would never let me carry anything heavy. I am perfectly capable and willing, he just won't allow it.

 

[mikiemo83]

A happy King has a happy Queen

 

[anderson]

http://bitchmakemeasandwich.com/

 

[babalu87]

A happy King has a happy Queen

Give me a woman who really loves beer and and I will conquer the
world...

 

[Michigan Dave]

Tremendous. That is how things should be and how people used to be taught before manners were tossed aside.

SF87, your response is why you fail with teh ladies.

 

[tommysgirl]

Tremendous. That is how things should be and how people used to be taught before manners were tossed aside.

SF87, your response is why you fail with teh ladies.

This post makes me happy.

No matter the arrogant douche you are, you still know what is right no matter your ulterior motives for doing them ROFL

 

[dchester]

Girls are fragile, treat them gently.

Well, some parts of them are.

 

[Michigan Dave]

This post makes me happy.

No matter the arrogant douche you are, you still know what is right no matter your ulterior motives for doing them ROFL

I have and always will do those things. I was taught to hold the door for women, offer to carry their things, etc. Not just when there are ulterior motives, but that never hurt, either.

Of course, to this day I still write thank you cards when I receive a gift, because of my mother forcing me to do so when I was a kid. Sadly, basic manners are going away. And I always address the elderly as "Mr. ____" and "Mrs. ____".

 

[tommysgirl]

I have and always will do those things. I was taught to hold the door for women, offer to carry their things, etc. Not just when there are ulterior motives, but that never hurt, either.

Of course, to this day I still write thank you cards when I receive a gift, because of my mother forcing me to do so when I was a kid. Sadly, basic manners are going away. And I always address the elderly as "Mr. ____" and "Mrs. ____".

You were taught right. I let a lot of things slide with my kids, manners have never been one of them. My youngests first word was thank you. Course it was because he was trying to get a cookie, but the point remains the same ROFL

Teenagers now boggle my mind with the way they act, I have no idea what happened to basic rules of society.

 

[babalu87]

Who's gonna have a jack rag 4 life?