Derailed Brown non game thread

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SkiptoMyLou

SkiptoMyLou

Thank you, coach!
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A tough game for the defense, but I feel BB will have them ready.

Hope for the offense to exploit that Browns' defense, which looks like it can be had.
 
TommyD420 said:
I know people will be fired up for that video, but you can tell it's still not 100%.

And his ability to run is going to be seriously hindered. People want to pretend he's Brady and never runs, but it's been a much bigger part of his game this year.
Click to expand...

That's the right call.
As of yesterday, Zappe is starting this wk vs the Browns.
 
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Lots of good info in here

www.patriots.com

Game Preview: Patriots at Browns

The New England Patriots travel to face the Cleveland Browns on Sunday, October 16 at 1:00 PM ET.
www.patriots.com www.patriots.com

FORMER PATRIOTS
  • Corey Bojorquez (Patriots: Player P 2018^, Browns: Player P 2022)
  • Jacoby Brissett (Patriots: Player QB 2016, Browns: Player QB 2022)
  • Hjalte Froholdt (Patriots: Player G 2019-20, Browns: Player G 2022)
  • Charley Hughlett (Patriots: Player LS 2014^, Browns: Player LS 2014-)
  • Chad O'Shea (Patriots: WR Coach 2009-18, Browns: Pass Game Coord/WR 2020-)
^ - Preseason/Practice Squad Only
FORMER BROWNS
  • Carl Davis Jr. (Patriots: Player DL 2020-, Browns: Player DL 2018)
  • Daniel Ekuale (Patriots: Player DL 2021-, Browns: Player DL 2018-19)
  • Brian Hoyer (Patriots: Player QB 2020-, Browns: Player QB 2013-14)
  • Jabrill Peppers (Patriots: Player 2022, Browns: )
  • Mack Wilson Sr. (Patriots: , Browns: Player DB 2017-18)
  • Bill Belichick (Patriots: Head Coach 2000-, Browns: Head Coach 1991-95)
  • Billy Yates (Patriots: Asst. OL Billy Yates 2021, Browns: Player OL 2009-10)
 
TommyD420 said:
I know people will be fired up for that video, but you can tell it's still not 100%.

And his ability to run is going to be seriously hindered. People want to pretend he's Brady and never runs, but it's been a much bigger part of his game this year.
Click to expand...
I agree. Mac's mobility is a big part of his game this year. I don't see the reason to rush him back given it it the Browns and with the way Zappe is playing. Let Zappe play and then see how much further along Mac is next week. Even 4 weeks can be very early for a high angle sprain but I don't blame Mac for wanting to get back sooner.
 
TommyD420 said:
I know people will be fired up for that video, but you can tell it's still not 100%.

And his ability to run is going to be seriously hindered. People want to pretend he's Brady and never runs, but it's been a much bigger part of his game this year.
Click to expand...
Agreed that the ankle is not 100% in that video, and I don't think we rush him back. I'm not as high on Zappe as some are, but he was more or less successful doing what was asked of him.

That said, do we have Mac active as the backup QB in case something happens to Zappe? I don't think I'd be opposed to that, but I'm not close enough to the team to be aware of any personal/psychological dynamics that may come up. I do know that if Zappe takes a shot in the 3rd quarter, triggering the concussion protocol, and the game is in doubt, I'd rather have Mac come in than Gilbert Godfried. You'd need to make sure the playcalls are all about ensuring that he's protected, but I wouldn't kick and scream about that decision.
 
I think Zappe will play through week 7, the Chicago game. I feel that's the best course of action for multiple reasons.

It gives Jones 6 full weeks to recover, so he should be at/close to 100% by then.

Additionally, at that point, Jones and Zappe will each have three starts on the season, respectively. You then evaluate their play in those three weeks in as close to a 1-to-1 way as possible, and make the decision that's best for the team.
 
vertigho said:
I think Zappe will play through week 7, the Chicago game. I feel that's the best course of action for multiple reasons.

It gives Jones 6 full weeks to recover, so he should be at/close to 100% by then.

Additionally, at that point, Jones and Zappe will each have three starts on the season, respectively. You then evaluate their play in those three weeks in as close to a 1-to-1 way as possible, and make the decision that's best for the team.
Click to expand...
I don't think that will even be close to an apples to apples comparison. Zappe played the worst defense in the NFL, and with a bunch of backups. And Cleveland isn't exactly great shakes, nor is Chicago. Compared to Miami/Balt/Pitt, it's a different world.

And Zappe is running what is essentially a different offense. The structure is the same, but what he's asked to do is different, and it's as stripped down as it can be. I highly doubt they'll be at the same level 2 weeks from now.

A 2022 Zappe offense has a ceiling of a B-. A Mac offense has a ceiling of an A-. And the floors are different, too. They might be the same level, but how they look earning that D+ or C- will be very different.
 
Cleveland has the best tandem of Guards in the league, but I noticed they use Hjalte Froholdt as a fullback in some packages and he can lay the lumber. Will Kevin Stefanski decide to get cute and
pull a Dan Klecko on us? Just a thought.

I never understood why we gave up on Froholdt so soon. I figured he must be a screw-up off the field or something like that, because I thought he showed real promise.
 
Flagg the Wanderer said:
I don't think that will even be close to an apples to apples comparison. Zappe played the worst defense in the NFL, and with a bunch of backups. And Cleveland isn't exactly great shakes, nor is Chicago. Compared to Miami/Balt/Pitt, it's a different world.

And Zappe is running what is essentially a different offense. The structure is the same, but what he's asked to do is different, and it's as stripped down as it can be. I highly doubt they'll be at the same level 2 weeks from now.

A 2022 Zappe offense has a ceiling of a B-. A Mac offense has a ceiling of an A-. And the floors are different, too. They might be the same level, but how they look earning that D+ or C- will be very different.
Click to expand...

That difference in offensive style might be relevant. If, after another few weeks, BB feels the style of offense suited for Zappe is also the style that best suits the other players on offense, that will certainly be part of the calculus (or vice versa for Jones).
 
Flagg the Wanderer said:
I don't think that will even be close to an apples to apples comparison. Zappe played the worst defense in the NFL, and with a bunch of backups. And Cleveland isn't exactly great shakes, nor is Chicago. Compared to Miami/Balt/Pitt, it's a different world.

And Zappe is running what is essentially a different offense. The structure is the same, but what he's asked to do is different, and it's as stripped down as it can be. I highly doubt they'll be at the same level 2 weeks from now.

A 2022 Zappe offense has a ceiling of a B-. A Mac offense has a ceiling of an A-. And the floors are different, too. They might be the same level, but how they look earning that D+ or C- will be very different.
Click to expand...
I agree with most of this but whatever the reasons, the fact is Mac sucked statistically speaking, one of the worst if not the worst in the NFL and the eyeball test didn't look good either. Definitely not all on him, but some of the INT's were just awful decisions/throws, nothing to do with the line, the new offense, or the opponent. With that said, benching Mac could shatter the young man's confidence, a completely different situation than the Brady/Bledsoe one, not to mention Bledsoe was bad for over 2 straight seasons, he wasn't BB's guy, and every reason other people have already brought up. Not saying there's no chance of it happening but if it does I think that's a clear indicator of how he really feels about Mac, more than how he feels about Zappe. The more I think about it I just don't see it happening.
 
Flagg the Wanderer said:
I don't think that will even be close to an apples to apples comparison. Zappe played the worst defense in the NFL, and with a bunch of backups. And Cleveland isn't exactly great shakes, nor is Chicago. Compared to Miami/Balt/Pitt, it's a different world.

And Zappe is running what is essentially a different offense. The structure is the same, but what he's asked to do is different, and it's as stripped down as it can be. I highly doubt they'll be at the same level 2 weeks from now.

A 2022 Zappe offense has a ceiling of a B-. A Mac offense has a ceiling of an A-. And the floors are different, too. They might be the same level, but how they look earning that D+ or C- will be very different.
Click to expand...
Zappe also played GB and was one first down away from winning in OT
 
Mazz22 said:
Zappe also played GB and was one first down away from winning in OT
Click to expand...
Well, yes. But he didn't do much of anything in that game except not crash the car. He did better than I would have expected given the lack of prep time & snaps, etc. But if I had to guess I'd guess that Hoyer wins that game if not knocked out early. Zappe showed me more than I would have expected both weeks, but a long way from delivering on what Mac can bring to the table.

Mac is doing fine. He's pushing more this year, which is good, and the game has to re-slow down for him. Some of the INTs don't fall on him, though there are at least 2-3 that should have been INTs but weren't. You know when you stopped always checking your blind spot because you were subconsciously counting cars when you flicked your eyes to your rearview and side mirrors? Remember the first time you were wrong and terrified to find the car in your blind spot that you'd missed? That's kind of like what he's going through right now. He needs to "count cars" for those underneath LBs subconsciously, knowing that they're there (or are about to be there) even when his sightlines are blocked. If he's reading cover 3, there's a CB dropping into the deep third (or a S sliding over) to take the deep sideline away, even if he doesn't seem to be in that position right now.

...and he needs to keep building up the arm to shave that 1/8 to 1/4 second off the time that the ball is in the air.
 
Flagg the Wanderer said:
Well, yes. But he didn't do much of anything in that game except not crash the car. He did better than I would have expected given the lack of prep time & snaps, etc. But if I had to guess I'd guess that Hoyer wins that game if not knocked out early. Zappe showed me more than I would have expected both weeks, but a long way from delivering on what Mac can bring to the table.

Mac is doing fine. He's pushing more this year, which is good, and the game has to re-slow down for him. Some of the INTs don't fall on him, though there are at least 2-3 that should have been INTs but weren't. You know when you stopped always checking your blind spot because you were subconsciously counting cars when you flicked your eyes to your rearview and side mirrors? Remember the first time you were wrong and terrified to find the car in your blind spot that you'd missed? That's kind of like what he's going through right now. He needs to "count cars" for those underneath LBs subconsciously, knowing that they're there (or are about to be there) even when his sightlines are blocked. If he's reading cover 3, there's a CB dropping into the deep third (or a S sliding over) to take the deep sideline away, even if he doesn't seem to be in that position right now.

...and he needs to keep building up the arm to shave that 1/8 to 1/4 second off the time that the ball is in the air.
Click to expand...
What makes you say that?
 
Mazz22 said:
What makes you say that?
Click to expand...
He still has all the positives he brought to the table last year. Their arm strength is pretty comparable, maybe a slight edge to Zappe. Beyond that...
Processing speed: Mac
Decision making: Mac
Read defenses: Mac
Physical attributes: Mac
Mobility: Mac
Quick release: Mac
Accuracy & ball placement (for ball security, protecting the receivers, and setting up for YAC): Mac
Production in compressed area: Mac

The only thing I think that Mac seems to have regressed a bit is poise/confidence/demeanor, which makes some sense with Josh leaving and some chaos sorting through the OC decision making.
 
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