Hindsight in 2020 -- Redoing Some Recent Pats Drafts

[chevss454]

Those rankings are FO's DVOA Offense. The pats are 19th

 

[Mazz22]

He's still on his rookie contract so he's cheap at $2.5M/. If teams continue to defend him more and more effectively, will the Ravens pick up his 5th year option at a cost of $26M plus?
It's too early to tell either way but make no mistake, teams have shown he can be defended effectively.

They're ranked 23rd offensively thus far in 2020 by FO. They've had bad losses to the Chiefs, Titans and Pats scoring an avg of 20 pts in each game.
If they're "lethal", what term would you apply to the Patriots' offense which ranks 4 spots better at 19th?

Chevvs you can cherry pick any stats you want to try to make a strawman. The Ravens are 12th in points scored, the Pats are 27th. They have scored 20 or more points in 9 of 10 games. The Pats have scored 12 points or less in 3 games. The Ravens have ZERO regrets about taking Lamar and will pay him most likely before he ever gets to his 5th year.

 

[chevss454]

Chevvs you can cherry pick any stats you want to try to make a strawman. The Ravens are 12th in points scored, the Pats are 27th. They have scored 20 or more points in 9 of 10 games. The Pats have scored 12 points or less in 3 games. The Ravens have ZERO regrets about taking Lamar and will pay him most likely before he ever gets to his 5th year.

Cherry Pick? Strawman? You're really something, Mazz.
The Ravens are 6-4 (about to be 6-5). Lamar Jackson is PFF's 23rd ranked QB. Last year he was the 5th ranked QB. That's quite a drop from Top 5 to Below Average.
Would you pick up his 5th year option for $25M + based on his 23rd ranked performance?
No strawman and no cherry picking there. Just cold hard football facts.

BTW, Cam is ranked 18th.

 

[chevss454]

Finishing with FGs instead of TDs is this Pats team's biggest downfall.

 

[Mazz22]

Cherry Pick? Strawman? You're really something, Mazz.
The Ravens are 6-4 (about to be 6-5). Lamar Jackson is PFF's 23rd ranked QB. Last year he was the 5th ranked QB. That's quite a drop from Top 5 to Below Average.
Would you pick up his 5th year option for $25M + based on his 23rd ranked performance?
No strawman and no cherry picking there. Just cold hard football facts.

BTW, Cam is ranked 18th.

Chevvs, I don't know why you are trying so hard to demean Lamar. It is kind of bizarre. I already told you that the Ravens will pick up his 5th year option or extend him before the 5th year. They have ZERO regrets in taking him and know what what type of skill he possesses regardless of his various rankings this season when many teams and Qbs have struggled due to Covid and the no-offseason.

 

[chevss454]

Chevvs, I don't know why you are trying so hard to demean Lamar. It is kind of bizarre. I already told you that the Ravens will pick up his 5th year option or extend him before the 5th year. They have ZERO regrets in taking him and know what what type of skill he possesses regardless of his various rankings this season when many teams and Qbs have struggled due to Covid and the no-offseason.

I'm not demeaning poor Lamar. He's demeaning himself with his shit play this year. Interesting that you know the Ravens will pick up his 5th year option or extend him. You don't think the Raven's FO knows he's playing like crap?
0 regrets bc he was MVP and won some games...last year. How's that working out this year? He's a 1 dimensional QB in the mold of Griffin & Kaepernick if there ever was one.

 

[Mazz22]

I'm not demeaning poor Lamar. He's demeaning himself with his shit play this year. Interesting that you know the Ravens will pick up his 5th year option or extend him. You don't think the Raven's FO knows he's playing like crap?
0 regrets bc he was MVP and won some games...last year. How's that working out this year? He's a 1 dimensional QB in the mold of Griffin & Kaepernick if there ever was one.

Take a deep breath ... good ... now exhale. I am starting to wonder if Lamar threatened you. lol

 

[chevss454]

Take a deep breath ... good ... now exhale. I am starting to wonder if Lamar threatened you. lol

You want me to take a deep breath?
That's rich.

 

[Mazz22]

Let me give you a few stats so you will understand why Lamar is a lock to get extended by the Ravens and why no matter what your advanced stats say for this season, he is about the lowest down the list in terms of issues for the Ravens and they will pay him handsomely very shortly.

Lamar's record since 2018: 25-7
Completion percentage - 63%
TDs and INTs: 57/15 (led the league in passing TDs last year)

Now for the rushing:
2,476 yards in 2.5 seasons (an NFL record 1,206 in 2019; on pace for 1000 this year)
15 TDs

I don't know why you are trying to disparage him so badly when it is clear the Ravens have many issues on their team. Lamar is not one of them. The contract he will sign will be second only to Mahomes. Remember Harbaugh was about to be canned until Lamar showed up.

 

[OSUBuckeye]

Let me give you a few stats so you will understand why Lamar is a lock to get extended by the Ravens and why no matter what your advanced stats say for this season, he is about the lowest down the list in terms of issues for the Ravens and they will pay him handsomely very shortly.

Lamar's record since 2018: 25-7
Completion percentage - 63%
TDs and INTs: 57/15 (led the league in passing TDs last year)

Now for the rushing:
2,476 yards in 2.5 seasons (an NFL record 1,206 in 2019; on pace for 1000 this year)
15 TDs

I don't know why you are trying to disparage him so badly when it is clear the Ravens have many issues on their team. Lamar is not one of them. The contract he will sign will be second only to Mahomes. Remember Harbaugh was about to be canned until Lamar showed up.

I think Dak will sign a bigger contract than Lamar Jackson. Dak is head & shoulders a better NFL qb than Lamar Jackson , IMO.

 

[Mazz22]

I think Dak will sign a bigger contract than Lamar Jackson. Dak is head & shoulders a better NFL qb than Lamar Jackson , IMO.

It is possible just because he will be a FA but I don't think he is getting anything above Wilson. I don't think any of the GMs see him as a difference maker the way they do with Wilson, Mahomes, Lamar. I also think the Ravens will want to make a statement with Lamar's contract. Remember this is the team that made awful Joe Flacco the highest paid QB in the game after his one SB win.

 

[chevss454]

Let me give you a few stats so you will understand why Lamar is a lock to get extended by the Ravens and why no matter what your advanced stats say for this season, he is about the lowest down the list in terms of issues for the Ravens and they will pay him handsomely very shortly.

Lamar's record since 2018: 25-7
Completion percentage - 63%
TDs and INTs: 57/15 (led the league in passing TDs last year)

Now for the rushing:
2,476 yards in 2.5 seasons (an NFL record 1,206 in 2019; on pace for 1000 this year)
15 TDs

I don't know why you are trying to disparage him so badly when it is clear the Ravens have many issues on their team. Lamar is not one of them. The contract he will sign will be second only to Mahomes. Remember Harbaugh was about to be canned until Lamar showed up.

I'M NOT DISPARAGING HIM.
He's the one playing at the level of the 25th best QB! I'm stating a fact.
Harbaugh made a big mistake when he paid Flacco. Don't you think he'll want to be absolutely sure he doesn't make that mistake again?
Paying a huge payday to LJackson when he's playing so badly doesn't seem very smart to me. Harbaugh won't be in a hurry to pay him if he's playing like this.
Let's wait and see how he does next year, shall we?

 

[chevss454]

It is possible just because he will be a FA but I don't think he is getting anything above Wilson. I don't think any of the GMs see him as a difference maker the way they do with Wilson, Mahomes, Lamar. I also think the Ravens will want to make a statement with Lamar's contract. Remember this is the team that made awful Joe Flacco the highest paid QB in the game after his one SB win.

Exactly my point above!
How did that work out for Harbaugh?

 

[ParanoidPatriot]

There is an old saying that “hindsight is 20/20” – which basically means that it is easy to look back after the fact and know what the right thing to do was or at least way easier than knowing in advance. Nothing is a better example of that than the crapshoot that is the NFL draft, but.......I got curious.

Since the media is having a field day trying to roast Bill Belichick at the stake for our, lets say, lack of dynamic NFL talent at several key positions, I have been asking myself what the truth of the matter is and it’s hard to argue that this is clearly the case as we approach the halfway point of the most bizarre season in NFL history. We pretty much suck at TE, WR, LB and are subpar on the defensive line. QB is also a huge question mark, to put it kindly.

With all that in mind I have decided to have a little fun with all of this and revisit a few of our recent drafts just to see if there were any players available that might have been able to help us be a little more competitive in the year one AB (anno Brady). Let’s see what we could’ve done had we been a little bit sharper in the scouting department. Call it an exercise in imagination.

In order to make this simpler I just stuck with the draft slot we ended up with after trades (or whatever) and didn’t worry about all the little details. I just took a different guy than our GM did and I promise that in each case this is exactly the move I would have made (as if).

2017

Our first selection in this draft was Derek Rivers (83rd overall) and he’s been basically a hole on the roster ever since, but we could’ve taken WR Chris Godwin (84th) instead.

Next, we got zero help from OT Antonio Garcia taken at 85. I’ll pass over Kareem Hunt due to his anger management issues and take TE Jonnu Smith who has given the Titans 22 catches for 5 TDs this year and appears to be on the rise at a position where we could use a little help.

We took Deatrich Wise Jr. at 131 and the nicest thing I can say about him is he's an emotional player who is tall. He can’t set an edge and is not especially quick or strong, so I’ll push the eject button on him and go for RB Marlon Mack (143) who is hurt now, but has rushed for about 2400 yards and scored 20 TDs for the Colts.

Our 4th and last guy at pick 211 was Conor McDermott who was entirely forgettable ( other than the fact he came out of the closet as a gay man after being employed here) and while I’d love to add some defense to our roster I couldn’t pass on K Harrison Butker (233) who is deadly from about 60 on in and would’ve prevented us from rolling the dice with Nick Folk anytime we have to chance a 40-yard+ knuckleball from a guy whose own family likely covers their eyes when he kicks.

2018

We took Isiah Wynn (23) and Sony Michel (31) in the 1st round with some mixed results, but we could’ve instead had Lamar (MVP) Jackson (32) and Darius (DPOY) Leonard (36).

Unfortunately we then whiffed on Duke Dawson (56) but in a more perfect world we might have stumbled across Fred Warner (70) who just destroyed our offense last week.

We then selected Ja’Whaun Bentley at 143 but in my rich fantasy world we skipped the opportunity to take perhaps the least athletic LB in the entire league and took DT Bilal Nichols (145) who kicked some ass Thursday night for the Bears.


2019

While the results of this draft aren’t fully know, it represents a pretty good haul overall. However, it wasn’t hard for me to redo our first two picks.

I’m going to erase the selections of the much-maligned N. Harry (32) and the pine-riding Joejuan Williams (45) and go with Deebo Samuels (36) and D.K. Metcalf (64).

I’ll keep Chase Winovich and Damien Harris, but will swap Yodny Cajuste (101) for the Raiders’ pass rusher Mad Maxx Crosby (107).


Imagine, if you will, a current Pats team with the additions of these guys:

WR Chris Godwin, Deebo Samuel, D.K. Metcalf
TE Jonnu Smith
QB Lamar Jackson
RB Marlon Mack
K Harrison Butker

LB Darrius Leonard, Fred Warner
DT Bilal Nichols
DE Maxx Crosby

Good, fun exercise Hawg. I use to do this but stopped. I found that sticking needles in my eyes is less painful than thinking about what could have happened in a draft redo.

Everyone it seems is aboard the "should have drafted DJ" train. And in hindsight that is absolutely correct. However every team passed on him a couple of times including Seattle who drafted 2 players before taking him at #64.

Most of the draft "experts" were down on DJ calling him "fools gold" and "looks like Tarzan but plays like Jane". On the other hand, most draft experts raved about the Patriots choice at #32 of Harry.

BTW, I picked Wise in the exact spot that the Patriots took him and I still think it was a good pick. And, I think that Dugger will be and excellent player for years to come.

 

[Mazz22]

Exactly my point above!
How did that work out for Harbaugh?

Lol. It's harbaugh. I am not sure why Lamar is bothering you so much but he is getting paid and it will be a big contract.

 

[Mazz22]

I'M NOT DISPARAGING HIM.
He's the one playing at the level of the 25th best QB! I'm stating a fact.
Harbaugh made a big mistake when he paid Flacco. Don't you think he'll want to be absolutely sure he doesn't make that mistake again?
Paying a huge payday to LJackson when he's playing so badly doesn't seem very smart to me. Harbaugh won't be in a hurry to pay him if he's playing like this.
Let's wait and see how he does next year, shall we?

He's had an up and down season in a Covid season. It has happened to many teams/qbs. It does not come close to erasing his unanimous MVP season. Second year MVPs get paid. I am not sure what else to tell you. The Ravens love him.

 

[John Locke]

He's had an up and down season in a Covid season. It has happened to many teams/qbs. It does not come close to erasing his unanimous MVP season. Second year MVPs get paid. I am not sure what else to tell you. The Ravens love him.

That's great that they love him. I would never want him anywhere near the Pats roster. Too easy to figure out and defend against so far, as has been evidenced.

 

[chevss454]

Lol. It's harbaugh. I am not sure why Lamar is bothering you so much but he is getting paid and it will be a big contract.

Lamar doesn't bother me; stupidity bothers me.
Why are you so adamant he's getting paid big bucks soon?
Paying a player for what he did for me last year is the wrong way to run a franchise. Players get paid on present performance.
Just bc he played well 1 year doesn't mean he'll always play effectively. A top NFL QB has to have more than 1 tool in his toolbox and 1 is all he has.
We're seeing proof of that this year. Teams are stopping the run and making him pass. Easy peazy.

 

[Mazz22]

Why are you so adamant he's getting paid big bucks soon?

I am not being adamant about anything. You asked me over and over so I responded. Young, dynamic players who win an MVP in their second season and have a 25-7 record get paid. Look at past history of QBs. There is always the chance the Ravens move on but I would say that is remote regardless of any struggles he has had in this Covid season. The team overall has struggled compared to last year especially the play calling IMO. That being said, they are still poised to make the playoffs.

At any rate, we will find out soon enough so no sense in keep debating.