Let's Talk A Little Socialism

spacecrime

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That isn't redistribution of income. That is redistribution of property, assets whatever and NO ONE wants that.

Redistribution of income is about the rich paying their fair share of taxes.

How do you feel about earning $100K a year and paying $15K in income taxes while people making over a million a year and paying the same as you or less.

Just taking the last sentence, are you okay with it?
 
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johnlocke

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That isn't redistribution of income. That is redistribution of property, assets whatever and NO ONE wants that.

Redistribution of income is about the rich paying their fair share of taxes.

How do you feel about earning $100K a year and paying $15K in income taxes while people making over a million a year and paying the same as you or less.

Just taking the last sentence, are you okay with it?


Income is property, one of the most basic ones upon which others are derived, and no one has the moral right to mine nor anyone elses for any reason under the sun. If I wanna give that's on me, nobody else.
 
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aloyouis

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I stumbled upon this gem at www.rebelsociety.com. Read it through, then print it and give it to your kids.

Do you know who Mr. Browne is? According to Wikipedia, Harry Browne (1933 – 2006) was a free-market libertarian writer and investment analyst who was the Presidential candidate of the United States Libertarian Party in 1996 and 2000. He was also Director of the American Liberty Foundation.
I don’t know what these characteristics translate into or even the kind of person Harry Browne was. I did, however, come across this letter he wrote at Christmas to his then nine-year old daughter. The letter was dated December 25, 1966.
I have shared Harry’s letter over the years with circles of friends and family. The responses have varied. Some have whole-heartedly agreed with Harry, yet some reacted with defensiveness, even contempt, not only for Mr. Browne, but toward me for sharing. Some felt the letter was cynical, harsh, even cruel. There were also those who thought that Harry’s words to his daughter offered them a new perspective on life.
For me, the letter was a great reminder of the expectations we attach to people, outcomes and situations, and the potential blame we assign when we don’t receive what we have desired.
Who is responsible for life’s outcomes? Who is responsible for our experiences?
***

Harry’s letter to his daughter:

It’s Christmas and I have the usual problem of deciding what to give you. I know you might enjoy many things — books, games, clothes.
But I’m very selfish. I want to give you something that will stay with you for more than a few months or years. I want to give you a gift that might remind you of me every Christmas.
If I could give you just one thing, I’d want it to be a simple truth that took me many years to learn. If you learn it now, it may enrich your life in hundreds of ways. And it may prevent you from facing many problems that have hurt people who have never learned it.
The truth is simply this: No one owes you anything.

Significance

How could such a simple statement be important? It may not seem so, but understanding it can bless your entire life.
No one owes you anything.
It means that no one else is living for you, my child. Because no one is you. Each person is living for himself; his own happiness is all he can ever personally feel.
When you realize that no one owes you happiness or anything else, you’ll be freed from expecting what isn’t likely to be.
It means no one has to love you. If someone loves you, it’s because there’s something special about you that gives him happiness. Find out what that something special is and try to make it stronger in you, so that you’ll be loved even more.
When people do things for you, it’s because they want to — because you, in some way, give them something meaningful that makes them want to please you, not because anyone owes you anything.
No one has to like you. If your friends want to be with you, it’s not out of duty. Find out what makes others happy so they’ll want to be near you.
No one has to respect you. Some people may even be unkind to you. But once you realize that people don’t have to be good to you, and may not be good to you, you’ll learn to avoid those who would harm you. For you don’t owe them anything either.

Living your Life

No one owes you anything.
You owe it to yourself to be the best person possible. Because if you are, others will want to be with you, want to provide you with the things you want in exchange for what you’re giving to them.
Some people will choose not to be with you for reasons that have nothing to do with you. When that happens, look elsewhere for the relationships you want. Don’t make someone else’s problem your problem.
Once you learn that you must earn the love and respect of others, you’ll never expect the impossible and you won’t be disappointed. Others don’t have to share their property with you, nor their feelings or thoughts.
If they do, it’s because you’ve earned these things. And you have every reason to be proud of the love you receive, your friends’ respect, the property you’ve earned. But don’t ever take them for granted. If you do, you could lose them. They’re not yours by right; you must always earn them.

My Experience

A great burden was lifted from my shoulders the day I realized that no one owes me anything. For so long as I’d thought there were things I was entitled to, I’d been wearing myself out —physically and emotionally — trying to collect them.
No one owes me moral conduct, respect, friendship, love, courtesy, or intelligence. And once I recognized that, all my relationships became far more satisfying. I’ve focused on being with people who want to do the things I want them to do.
That understanding has served me well with friends, business associates, lovers, sales prospects, and strangers. It constantly reminds me that I can get what I want only if I can enter the other person’s world. I must try to understand how he thinks, what he believes to be important, what he wants. Only then can I appeal to someone in ways that will bring me what I want.
And only then can I tell whether I really want to be involved with someone. And I can save the important relationships for those with whom I have the most in common.
It’s not easy to sum up in a few words what has taken me years to learn. But maybe if you re-read this gift each Christmas, the meaning will become a little clearer every year.
I hope so, for I want more than anything else for you to understand this simple truth that can set you free:

No one owes you anything.
 

HSanders

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i know i've posted this somewhere else on here. one of my fave tshirts i had made has this quote: "nobody owes you, nobody owns you" on the front.
on the back, it says "free people aren't equal. equal people aren't free".
 

aloyouis

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i know i've posted this somewhere else on here. one of my fave tshirts i had made has this quote: "nobody owes you, nobody owns you" on the front.
on the back, it says "free people aren't equal. equal people aren't free".
I’m going to Google that and order one when we get home.
 
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johnlocke

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Harry Browne was the first presidential candidate I voted for as he most resembled my 20-year-old thoughts. However, over the years I have become deeply disappointed in his support of anarchy that he always held that I didn't know at the time.
 

Grandmaster B

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Income is property, one of the most basic ones upon which others are derived, and no one has the moral right to mine nor anyone elses for any reason under the sun. If I wanna give that's on me, nobody else.
That income is made possible by the infrastructure that we paid for. By a workforce that we educated.

Randians wanna pretend like all of this just happens in a vaccuum. Without the society that we all paid for, these businesses would struggle for all of these basic services to bring their services to people.

At best, you would have corporate sponsorships of roads, and would lock out competitors. You could never, as an upstart, challenge the status quo.
 
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johnlocke

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That income is made possible by the infrastructure that we paid for. By a workforce that we educated.

Randians wanna pretend like all of this just happens in a vaccuum. Without the society that we all paid for, these businesses would struggle for all of these basic services to bring their services to people.

At best, you would have corporate sponsorships of roads, and would lock out competitors. You could never, as an upstart, challenge the status quo.

You have it completely backward man.
 

aloyouis

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Imagine having to deliver your goods on Amazon Primeways.
I can see the pothole free roads in my minds eye as I type this!

I paid separately to have my children educated k-12 while also paying my property taxes and other required fees and costs. I continue to do so for them in college.

I also pay a shit ton of taxes (relatively speaking) and use almost no services while the inverse is true for people that game the system.

You for instance:

You don't HAVE to screw your landlord, but you happily do so while advocating for zoning elsewhere to be destroyed. Imagine that.

You don't VOLUNTARILY pay more in taxes than you are obligated to pay while advocating that others be forced to pay more in taxes. Imagine that.

The examples are endless and they all point to the left (and your) hypocrisy.

And you respond by name calling and creating straw men.
 

aloyouis

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And the rich people in the poor country give it to rich liberal politicians in the original country...
 

aloyouis

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That isn't redistribution of income. That is redistribution of property, assets whatever and NO ONE wants that.

Redistribution of income is about the rich paying their fair share of taxes.

How do you feel about earning $100K a year and paying $15K in income taxes while people making over a million a year and paying the same as you or less.

Just taking the last sentence, are you okay with it?
100%
 

aloyouis

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A man named Tom Nicholson posted on his Facebook account the sports car that he had just bought and how a man approached and told him that the money used to buy this car could've fed thousands of less fortunate people.
His response to this man made him famous on the internet. READ his story as stated on Facebook below:
A guy looked at my Corvette the other day and said,
"I wonder how many people could have been fed for the money that sports car cost?
I replied I'm not sure;
it fed a lot of families in Bowling Green, Kentucky who built it,
it fed the people who make the tires,
it fed the people who made the components that went into it,
it fed the people in the copper mine who mined the copper for the wires,
it fed people in at Caterpillar who make the trucks that haul the copper ore.
It fed the trucking people who hauled it from the plant to the dealer
and fed the people working at the dealership and their families.
BUT,... I have to admit, I guess I really don’t know how many people it fed.
That is the difference between capitalism and the welfare mentality.
When you buy something, you put money in people’s pockets and give them dignity for their skills.
When you give someone something for nothing, you rob them of their dignity and self-worth.
Capitalism is freely giving your money in exchange for something of value.
Socialism is having the government take your money against your will and give it to someone else for doing nothing.
 
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