Looking at the Patriots - 2018

Dwight Schrute

Deplorable #63174288
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
41,099
Reaction score
4,443
Points
113
Age
53
Location
America?s Hometown
I think Gronk is a fascinating case study right now. His cap hits are high the next two seasons. He is also still on his 6 year deal so he wants a new deal. But his back issues and overall health issues have to be a concern for BB in terms of a new contract with a lot of guaranteed money. He will also be 29 in May.

I am guessing Gronk is floating out this retirement storyline to try to force a new deal as he does not want anymore incentive based contracts. I don't blame him but his injury history/age has to have BB concerned.

Not sure which way this one will go but I would like to see us draft a TE as opposed to FA or another trade as we have been striking out there for some time.

His cap hits aren’t high.

It’s incentive based. High only if he performs. And even then, value based on comps of other TEs.
 

Mazz22

Age 43 and STILL playing like a champ
Joined
Jan 8, 2014
Messages
11,162
Reaction score
1,099
Points
113
Location
MA
His cap hits aren’t high.

It’s incentive based. High only if he performs. And even then, value based on comps of other TEs.

These next two years are not incentative based years for him, http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-england-patriots/rob-gronkowski-6551/

Only last year was incentive based because his contract for last year only paid him $4mil in base salary. Next year he gets paid 8 mil plus roster and workout bonuses (1 mil total) so $9 mil for the year. His cap hit will be $11 mil. In 2019 his base is 9 mil plus the bonuses (1 mil total) so $10 mil total and his cap hit will be $12 mil. Here is the breakdown, https://heavy.com/sports/2018/02/rob-gronkowski-salary-contract-how-much-money/

As is typical of the Pats, they more or less backloaded the last two years of his deal. I would imagine he wants a new deal with more guaranteed money and wants his base to be $10 mil.

It is also worth mentioning that if the Pats were to part ways with him (unlikely) his dead cap hits are only $4 mil for this year, $2 mil for next year.
 

Dwight Schrute

Deplorable #63174288
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
41,099
Reaction score
4,443
Points
113
Age
53
Location
America?s Hometown
These next two years are not incentative based years for him, http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-england-patriots/rob-gronkowski-6551/

Only last year was incentive based because his contract for last year only paid him $4mil in base salary. Next year he gets paid 8 mil plus roster and workout bonuses (1 mil total) so $9 mil for the year. His cap hit will be $11 mil. In 2019 his base is 9 mil plus the bonuses (1 mil total) so $10 mil total and his cap hit will be $12 mil. Here is the breakdown, https://heavy.com/sports/2018/02/rob-gronkowski-salary-contract-how-much-money/

As is typical of the Pats, they more or less backloaded the last two years of his deal. I would imagine he wants a new deal with more guaranteed money and wants his base to be $10 mil.

It is also worth mentioning that if the Pats were to part ways with him (unlikely) his dead cap hits are only $4 mil for this year, $2 mil for next year.

My bad.

Thought all 3 were incentive.
 

Hawg73

Mediocre with flashes of brilliance
Joined
Nov 26, 2002
Messages
22,199
Reaction score
3,253
Points
113
Age
64
Location
Gumdrop house on Lollipop Ln.
All I know for sure is that if Gronk were to actually sign a proposed deal with the WWE then we are going to be one very unhappy group of Patriots fans.

Can you imagine?

It makes me think of the time Hulk Hogan was still huge in wrestling and he came by to visit the Pats. Somebody told him that with his size and ability he might make a pretty good DE and Hogan replied with: "Maybe, but I'd have to take a pay cut, brother."

Of course, that was Hogan, but maybe the idea of them throwing around huge money to get all the publicity that would come with signing Gronk isn't as far-fetched as it might seem.

From what I can come up with, Brock Lesnar was the highest paid WWE guy in 2017 with a salary of 12M.

I'd call it a longshot.
 

chevss454

Data-driven decision-making is science and art.
Joined
Mar 8, 2010
Messages
59,934
Reaction score
8,966
Points
113
Location
Canton, MA
Very nice gesture by the Patriots

Lawrence Guy didn't play enough snaps last season to earn incentive money. However, the Patriots reportedly are paying him anyway. Here's how: http://nesn.com/?p=820923


Also, in his last 15 games, Nate Solder allowed only one sack on 549 passing plays. That’s why re-signing him is the Pats’ top priority this offseason.
 

Ryan91

RIP Gran - Always love you
Joined
Oct 18, 2011
Messages
4,012
Reaction score
183
Points
63
Age
29
Location
Edinburgh
Website
twitter.com
Just seen this from PFF - the top graded QBs in the 2017 NFL Season (Regular & Post-season) - Brady is number 1 by a fair margin.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The highest graded QBs from 2017! <a href="https://t.co/wqUbx6Asrx">pic.twitter.com/wqUbx6Asrx</a></p>— Pro Football Focus (@PFF) <a href="https://twitter.com/PFF/status/965017025260216320?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 18, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Cliff? What cliff?
 

skippyx

Active member
Joined
Nov 21, 2015
Messages
441
Reaction score
65
Points
28
Location
Houston
There are a few scary things about the 2018 cap.

They are handing out about 30 million in raises (cap numbers) to guys like Brady(8), Cooks(6.9), Gronk(4.4), Gilmore(3.9), Hightower(3.1), Cannon(2.2), McCourty(1), Guy(0.5)

There are only a few players like Chung (-2.4) who are due less against the cap.

There are some obvious moves like cutting Branch (save 3.5) and Dwayne Allen (save 5.0) Maybe Gilislee (save 2.2) Bennett(6.2 cap) may retire, or maybe they get creative with him.

I am not worried about replacing Amendola with Jules back and Mitchell getting healthy. RB is going to be weird. Would Vereen come back cheap for a year or 2 after he got his payday in NY? Do they cut Gilislee and bring back Burkhead? What do they do at LT and depth T? Is Rowe their #2 corner or do they target a mid range guy?
 

skippyx

Active member
Joined
Nov 21, 2015
Messages
441
Reaction score
65
Points
28
Location
Houston
Just seen this from PFF - the top graded QBs in the 2017 NFL Season (Regular & Post-season) - Brady is number 1 by a fair margin.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The highest graded QBs from 2017! <a href="https://t.co/wqUbx6Asrx">pic.twitter.com/wqUbx6Asrx</a></p>— Pro Football Focus (@PFF) <a href="https://twitter.com/PFF/status/965017025260216320?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 18, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Cliff? What cliff?

Brady should have been unanimous MVP this year. Todd Guley had an awesome 3 game stretch but his year was nothing special.

I do have to say that any rating system that thinks Matt Ryan was as good as Drew Brees this year is fairly useless.
 

Mazz22

Age 43 and STILL playing like a champ
Joined
Jan 8, 2014
Messages
11,162
Reaction score
1,099
Points
113
Location
MA
Just seen this from PFF - the top graded QBs in the 2017 NFL Season (Regular & Post-season) - Brady is number 1 by a fair margin.


Cliff? What cliff?
That is because in additional to his regular season MVP performance, he had a blistering post-season. The best 3 game post-season run of his career with 8 TDs, 0 picks, 1,140 yards passing, 108 passer rating. Oh and he did all that with a 12 stitch gash on his throwing hand. :coffee:

One other tid bit - Brady has a 97 passer rating for his regular season career. He has a 98 rating in the Super Bowl.
 

Mazz22

Age 43 and STILL playing like a champ
Joined
Jan 8, 2014
Messages
11,162
Reaction score
1,099
Points
113
Location
MA
Brady should have been unanimous MVP this year. Todd Guley had an awesome 3 game stretch but his year was nothing special.

I do have to say that any rating system that thinks Matt Ryan was as good as Drew Brees this year is fairly useless.

The Gurley mantra for MVP is one of the best examples of the media hate toward Brady. Imagine if it had been Rodgers who was having Brady's season, does Gurley even get mentioned for his little run in Dec? Does Antonio Brown get a mention with his 9 Td catches? It is a prime example of the ridiculous media bias toward Brady that has prevented him from winning more MVPs over his career.

Still, as much as it sucks to not have gotten ring #6, I take a lot of joy and solace in Brady's third league MVP as it moves him up to rarified air in NFL history with only a handful of players ever winning it 3 times and adds yet another layer of cement to his already minted GOAT status. It also has Rodgers talking already about wanting to win another MVP (he has two) as we all know he is more concerned about his individual accomplishments than his team winning a championship. :coffee:
 

Dwight Schrute

Deplorable #63174288
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
41,099
Reaction score
4,443
Points
113
Age
53
Location
America?s Hometown
There are a few scary things about the 2018 cap.

They are handing out about 30 million in raises (cap numbers) to guys like Brady(8), Cooks(6.9), Gronk(4.4), Gilmore(3.9), Hightower(3.1), Cannon(2.2), McCourty(1), Guy(0.5)

There are only a few players like Chung (-2.4) who are due less against the cap.

There are some obvious moves like cutting Branch (save 3.5) and Dwayne Allen (save 5.0) Maybe Gilislee (save 2.2) Bennett(6.2 cap) may retire, or maybe they get creative with him.

I am not worried about replacing Amendola with Jules back and Mitchell getting healthy. RB is going to be weird. Would Vereen come back cheap for a year or 2 after he got his payday in NY? Do they cut Gilislee and bring back Burkhead? What do they do at LT and depth T? Is Rowe their #2 corner or do they target a mid range guy?

Oh god.

Another Amendola gone acolyte.
 

Dwight Schrute

Deplorable #63174288
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
41,099
Reaction score
4,443
Points
113
Age
53
Location
America?s Hometown
If the Pats get rid of Dola who will have a quiet regular season only to put in clutch performances in the post-season?

Exactly.

Add glowing praise from the HC and QB.

And the fact when a clutch play needs to be made it’s DA or Gronk TB looks to.

Roster lock.
 

Mazz22

Age 43 and STILL playing like a champ
Joined
Jan 8, 2014
Messages
11,162
Reaction score
1,099
Points
113
Location
MA
By far the scariest.




:suicide:

I like Rowe although his injury history is a concern but don't sleep on Jonathan Jones who took big strides forward this year. For all the talk about Butler in the SB, we missed Jones just as much maybe moreso.
 

PumpDee

They Hate Us Cuz They Ain't Us.
Joined
Oct 13, 2009
Messages
10,905
Reaction score
1,924
Points
113
Age
41
Location
Rhode Island (it's not really an island)
I like Rowe although his injury history is a concern but don't sleep on Jonathan Jones who took big strides forward this year. For all the talk about Butler in the SB, we missed Jones just as much maybe moreso.

I like Rowe too. But as a #3, not a #2. He's good in spurts and mostly against bigger receivers.


Have we completely written off Cyrus Jones at this point?
 

Mazz22

Age 43 and STILL playing like a champ
Joined
Jan 8, 2014
Messages
11,162
Reaction score
1,099
Points
113
Location
MA
I like Rowe too. But as a #3, not a #2. He's good in spurts and mostly against bigger receivers.


Have we completely written off Cyrus Jones at this point?

I don't think BB has written off Cyrus. I really don't expect us to make a big splash at CB. It really is not a need compared to the front 7 especially DE/OLB. I don't see BB going out and spending a lot on a second CB given what we are paying Gilmore. I think the guys we have will be fine.
 

Mazz22

Age 43 and STILL playing like a champ
Joined
Jan 8, 2014
Messages
11,162
Reaction score
1,099
Points
113
Location
MA
Here are Barwell's thoughts on what the Pats should do this off-season. I thought this was pretty good although I really don't believe Gronk is retiring this season but I do see Cooks as his obvious replacement. I had said this back last off-season when we signed Cooks that he would be viewed as the dynamic playmaker and get Gronk's money. But I don't think that happens just yet.

Also, no mention of James Harrison who we should absolutely re-sign at cheap money given he will be 40. That is a no brainer to me. He obviously has the desire and physical durability of Seau who played until he was 42.

If you want to read his thoughts on the other AFC East teams/AFC here is the link, http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/pag...trades-free-agency-cuts-bill-barnwell#AFCEast

New England Patriots
1. Pick up the fifth-year option for Malcom Brown. The Texas product hasn't grown into a star defensive lineman for the Patriots, but Brown has been a three-year starter for the Pats and serves as a valuable part of their rotation on the interior. The Patriots might not necessarily think about signing Brown to an extension this offseason, but keeping him around for 2019 is a no-brainer.

2. Clear out cap space. There are a few obvious moves for the Pats to make. Martellus Bennett won't be back at a cap number of $6.2 million, nor will backup tight end Dwayne Allen, who has a $5 million salary. New England also won't pick up Alan Branch's option after the defensive tackle fell out of the rotation, freeing up an additional $3.6 million. Finally, David Harris might retire but won't be around for 2018 at his current cap hit of $2.8 million. Cutting those four guys would free up just under $17 million and push the Pats to $34 million in free space.

3. Extend Brandin Cooks. The 24-year-old is entering the fifth-year option of his rookie deal, and while the Patriots don't typically pay wideouts No. 1 receiver money, Cooks might be an exception. The Patriots likely will change their offense some after Rob Gronkowski retires, a move that could come as early as this offseason. In the absence of a replacement for Gronk -- and there might not be a player in football history who is similar to him -- the Pats will think about replacing their star tight end as the long-term focal point of their offense with a star wideout.

Cooks probably isn't in line to come away with the sort of top-tier deals Odell Beckham Jr. and Mike Evans are about to sign, but he won't be far off. The five-year, $81 million extension DeAndre Hopkins inked last August should be similar to whatever deal Cooks ends up signing, whether that's in New England or elsewhere.

4. Extend Trey Flowers and Shaq Mason. The Patriots' two best selections from the 2015 draft were actually fourth-rounders. Flowers has emerged as a steady pass-rusher for the Patriots, and while he mustered only 6.5 sacks in 14 games last season, the 25 knockdowns Flowers registered suggest he has double-digit sack potential in 2018. And though Mason's final memory of the 2017 season might be getting beaten by Brandon Graham on that critical strip-sack of Tom Brady in the fourth quarter of the Super Bowl, he improved noticeably over the course of the campaign and was New England's best lineman at any spot for most of the year.

Both Flowers and Mason will be unrestricted free agents after the 2018 season, and while the Patriots have them both on bargain-basement rookie contracts this year, it would make sense for them to at least try and extend both before free agency. Flowers' low sack totals might help keep his price tag down. I wonder if the Patriots might be able to secure the 24-year-old on a deal with an average annual salary of $10 million to $11 million. Mason should come in slightly cheaper, as he'll be closer to $8 million to $9 million per year.

5. Address left tackle. Mason and Marcus Cannon, whose 2017 seasons were riddled by injuries, will be manning the right side of the Patriots' line in 2018. Joe Thuney is a useful run-blocking guard on the other side. David Andrews is signed to a low-cost, long-term deal at center. Four of the five spots are set for the Pats in 2018.

Left tackle? That's wide-open. Nate Solder is a free agent, and there's a chance the 29-year-old could step away from football as his young son fights cancer. Cannon could move to the left side, but the Patriots replaced him in 2017 with a rotation of Cameron Fleming and LaAdrian Waddle, who were ineffective and are now both free agents. The Patriots drafted a possible replacement for Solder last year -- third-rounder Antonio Garcia -- but the Troy product is a project who missed his entire rookie season with an undisclosed injury. It would be risky at best to protect Brady's blindside with Garcia.

It's likely the Patriots add a tackle this offseason, either with a high draft pick or as a cap casualty. Jason Peters and Jared Veldheer would make sense as short-term options who are likely to be released by their current employers. The Patriots might also look to draft a tackle with the 31st or 43rd overall selections in this year's draft.
 
Top