Looking at the Patriots - 2021

SkiptoMyLou

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That darn cap yet we managed to pay Wilfork, McGinest, Law but we just couldn't pay Jones.
Nonsense.

Maybe Belichick realized Jones wouldn't be a big of an impact when it mattered most and decided to use the money elsewhere? Wild thought, I know, since BB is so incompetent.
 
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spacecrime

spacecrime

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Don't you know? The cap is just a math trick, or old math if you will. It doesn't really exist and even if it did it could be manipulated with impunity. The cap is just what losing teams use as an excuse. Get with the times, man. I can't be broke, I still have checks.
That was Felger's line 20 years ago when I used to listen to him. "I don't believe in the cap. It's just a lot of nonsense. Teams can do whatever they want to get around it. They paid xxx for that guy, and now you tell me they can't pay yyy for this guy?"

He (and his acolytes) refuse to believe you cannot spend all the money you want. No concept that future cap is a charge card and it will come due. There have been other teams in cap hell before, and the Pats were last year and to a large degree the year before. The difference was BB took the hit and didn't continue to borrow. He cleared the dead money and had a ton to spend two years after that.
 
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chevss454

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That was Felger's line 20 years ago when I used to listen to him. "I don't believe in the cap. It's just a lot of nonsense. Teams can do whatever they want to get around it. They paid xxx for that guy, and now you tell me they can't pay yyy for this guy?"

He (and his acolytes) refuse to believe you cannot spend all the money you want. No concept that future cap is a charge card and it will come do. There have been other teams in cap hell before, and the Pats were last year and to a large degree the year before. The difference was BB took the hit and didn't continue to borrow. He cleared the dead money and had a ton to spend two years after that.

It amazes me how many people think the cap is nothing.
 

BostonTim

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That was Felger's line 20 years ago when I used to listen to him. "I don't believe in the cap. It's just a lot of nonsense. Teams can do whatever they want to get around it. They paid xxx for that guy, and now you tell me they can't pay yyy for this guy?"

He (and his acolytes) refuse to believe you cannot spend all the money you want. No concept that future cap is a charge card and it will come do. There have been other teams in cap hell before, and the Pats were last year and to a large degree the year before. The difference was BB took the hit and didn't continue to borrow. He cleared the dead money and had a ton to spend two years after that.
Are we also 'sposed to kneel before his acolytes?
 

D2maine

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there is also the ped history with jones's brother to consider. knowing how the nfl has always gone after the pats for anything they could even if it meant making shit up, i could see BB thinking that moving on from Jones might be better than risking another "gate"

so jones had a number of things going against him:

cap cost - keep jones or hightower plus cap for other players plus a 2nd rd pick in a draft where they didn't have a first because of bull shit.
history of late season productivity drop
stat collector against the weak but vanished against the good teams
the synthetic mj incident during the playoffs
family history of ped's
 

Big/Sky/Fly

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there is also the ped history with jones's brother to consider. knowing how the nfl has always gone after the pats for anything they could even if it meant making shit up, i could see BB thinking that moving on from Jones might be better than risking another "gate"

so jones had a number of things going against him:

cap cost - keep jones or hightower plus cap for other players plus a 2nd rd pick in a draft where they didn't have a first because of bull shit.
history of late season productivity drop
stat collector against the weak but vanished against the good teams
the synthetic mj incident during the playoffs
family history of ped's
Jon loves his cocaine...
 

Mazz22

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I was listening to Bedard yesterday and had a really interesting take on the Patriots since the end of 2019 (link is below).

The Patriots are 4-9 in one possession games since Thanksgiving of 2019. Their overall record is 9-14. In Bedard's opinion, this is because the defense has declined since Flores left after the 2018 season. He said Bill's son and Mayo have not done a good enough job coaching especially in close games.

It's interesting that all of us, myself included have been so focused on the Qb that we may have missed the most obvious - the defense has been poorly coached. Bedard talked specifically how awful our defensive strategy was on the final drive slant pass play not having Jones out there. He also mentioned how Flores knew that by bringing pressure it would make Jones check down and then all Miami had to do was wrap up the runner. So basically his feel was that we were outcoached.

He also mentioned that the offense is not dynamic enough, something I have been saying since the draft. We just don't have explosive guys that can get you chunk plays so having these long 12-14 plays is just begging for a penalty or a turnover. The margin for error is razor thin. Our 8 penalties is the most penalties than we had any game last year. I think speaks to all the new players from FAs to the rookies. So many new guys who came from other systems trying to learn ours.

Here is the full segment, The Patriots Play in Close Games // 10 Questions with Greg Bedard // Patriots-Jets Preview - 9/14 (Hour 2)
 

vertigho

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I was listening to Bedard yesterday and had a really interesting take on the Patriots since the end of 2019 (link is below).

The Patriots are 4-9 in one possession games since Thanksgiving of 2019. Their overall record is 9-14. In Bedard's opinion, this is because the defense has declined since Flores left after the 2018 season. He said Bill's son and Mayo have not done a good enough job coaching especially in close games.

It's interesting that all of us, myself included have been so focused on the Qb that we may have missed the most obvious - the defense has been poorly coached. Bedard talked specifically how awful our defensive strategy was on the final drive slant pass play not having Jones out there. He also mentioned how Flores knew that by bringing pressure it would make Jones check down and then all Miami had to do was wrap up the runner. So basically his feel was that we were outcoached.

He also mentioned that the offense is not dynamic enough, something I have been saying since the draft. We just don't have explosive guys that can get you chunk plays so having these long 12-14 plays is just begging for a penalty or a turnover. The margin for error is razor thin. Our 8 penalties is the most penalties than we had any game last year. I think speaks to all the new players from FAs to the rookies. So many new guys who came from other systems trying to learn ours.

Here is the full segment, The Patriots Play in Close Games // 10 Questions with Greg Bedard // Patriots-Jets Preview - 9/14 (Hour 2)

Would you have preferred to have Jones on the field instead of Phillips with under 3 minutes to play and the defense needing to stop the run?

It’s obvious why they were playing a big nickel with Phillips in lieu of Jones at that point in the game.

I do think Flores is a really good coach and I wish he was still our DC.
 

Mazz22

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Would you have preferred to have Jones on the field instead of Phillips with under 3 minutes to play and the defense needing to stop the run?

It’s obvious why they were playing a big nickel with Phillips in lieu of Jones at that point in the game.

I do think Flores is a really good coach and I wish he was still our DC.
I didn't realize the personnel until I listened to Bedard. It was 1st and 14 from the 5 yard line. I think everyone knew it was going to be a pass and Miami went to their bread and butter slant play that they ran a few times and we never stopped. I agree with Bedard that Jones should have been in there but we played so far off of Parker and I don't know why. I do agree it was coaching on that sequence. I think what was more frustrating to me is after that play, we knew the Fins would run the clock and we could not stop the run at all. They ran the clock out on us. I think that probably speaks more to the interior of our Dline not being good enough which was the most surprising part of the game to me given how much we upgraded our D and Miami's Oline not being very good.

One other thing Bedard said was that he felt our front 7 was really slow. He said that is why Phillips was brought up into the box in the second half. That also makes me nervous as we play some really good offenses after the Jets.
 

aloyouis

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I was listening to Bedard yesterday and had a really interesting take on the Patriots since the end of 2019 (link is below).

The Patriots are 4-9 in one possession games since Thanksgiving of 2019. Their overall record is 9-14. In Bedard's opinion, this is because the defense has declined since Flores left after the 2018 season. He said Bill's son and Mayo have not done a good enough job coaching especially in close games.

It's interesting that all of us, myself included have been so focused on the Qb that we may have missed the most obvious - the defense has been poorly coached. Bedard talked specifically how awful our defensive strategy was on the final drive slant pass play not having Jones out there. He also mentioned how Flores knew that by bringing pressure it would make Jones check down and then all Miami had to do was wrap up the runner. So basically his feel was that we were outcoached.

He also mentioned that the offense is not dynamic enough, something I have been saying since the draft. We just don't have explosive guys that can get you chunk plays so having these long 12-14 plays is just begging for a penalty or a turnover. The margin for error is razor thin. Our 8 penalties is the most penalties than we had any game last year. I think speaks to all the new players from FAs to the rookies. So many new guys who came from other systems trying to learn ours.

Here is the full segment, The Patriots Play in Close Games // 10 Questions with Greg Bedard // Patriots-Jets Preview - 9/14 (Hour 2)

How Kraft has been able to avoid reading you here and implementing your ingenious thoughts and ideas is beyond me. Clearly he is unaware of your prowess.

I suggest you go over to the stadium and tell him yourself (no, don't). He will listen and you owe it to him to tell him what he should do (no, he won't). If security gets in your way or otherwise prevents you from saving the team from certain destruction you should force your way past them and run to Krafts office (no, don't). If you are stopped (somehow) you should create of document containing all of your posts and mail it (plain envelope only) to Shank so that he can make your genius known in the Globe (yes, please do this).

Don't wait. Time is ticking and without you, the team is doomed to lose this week (and every week).

After Kraft fully implements your plans I am 100% positive that Brady will find a way to break his contract with the Bucs and come back to you....er, I mean...the Patriots and the earth will regain it's proper tilt and rotation. Side benefit is that global warming (or is it cooling?) will reverse and we all will live as a result.

Do you understand why this is so important now?

Go! Don't wait! Do not be stopped!!! (no, don't)

God Speed!!!
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*Please don't actually do this. If you could get to Kraft you would undeniably convince him, but he has too much security and you will fail. DON'T GO THERE.

Take it up with a professional instead. Department of Psychiatry
 
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D2maine

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I was listening to Bedard yesterday and had a really interesting take on the Patriots since the end of 2019 (link is below).

The Patriots are 4-9 in one possession games since Thanksgiving of 2019. Their overall record is 9-14. In Bedard's opinion, this is because the defense has declined since Flores left after the 2018 season. He said Bill's son and Mayo have not done a good enough job coaching especially in close games.

It's interesting that all of us, myself included have been so focused on the Qb that we may have missed the most obvious - the defense has been poorly coached. Bedard talked specifically how awful our defensive strategy was on the final drive slant pass play not having Jones out there. He also mentioned how Flores knew that by bringing pressure it would make Jones check down and then all Miami had to do was wrap up the runner. So basically his feel was that we were outcoached.

He also mentioned that the offense is not dynamic enough, something I have been saying since the draft. We just don't have explosive guys that can get you chunk plays so having these long 12-14 plays is just begging for a penalty or a turnover. The margin for error is razor thin. Our 8 penalties is the most penalties than we had any game last year. I think speaks to all the new players from FAs to the rookies. So many new guys who came from other systems trying to learn ours.

Here is the full segment, The Patriots Play in Close Games // 10 Questions with Greg Bedard // Patriots-Jets Preview - 9/14 (Hour 2)

this is against my better judgement but here goes:

all off-season Chevss has made the point to you and this board that the D last year and the end of 2019 fell off a cliff(self evident to anybody with a clue) - you spent that time arguing that Cam was the issue.

now Bedard comes along and makes the exact same point except Bedard spins it as bad BB and suddenly its the greatest football insight you have ever heard of because it fits your confirmation bias.

are you ever going form your own opinions or is every point you ever make just the latest talking point from the poison pens of the media?

please just stop
 

Mazz22

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this is against my better judgement but here goes:

all off-season Chevss has made the point to you and this board that the D last year and the end of 2019 fell off a cliff(self evident to anybody with a clue) - you spent that time arguing that Cam was the issue.

now Bedard comes along and makes the exact same point except Bedard spins it as bad BB and suddenly its the greatest football insight you have ever heard of because it fits your confirmation bias.

are you ever going form your own opinions or is every point you ever make just the latest talking point from the poison pens of the media?

please just stop
I said I found his take interesting as he was specifically citing one possession games since the end of 2019. I had no idea what our W-L record was in those games.

He then gave some specific examples of how he felt our coaching was inferior and he cited Steve B and Mayo. He did not mention Bill and neither did I. He specifically said the defense struggled when Flores left. He also mentioned how the personnel also deteriorated which IMO is just a big of an issue as our front 7 had gotten old and slow. This does not absolve the terrible QB play we got last year or the horrific personnel that both Brady and Cam had to play with either. But it does add another dimension to see how a team that was 10-1 after 11 games in 2019 has fallen to 9-14 since. As with anything, I don't think the answers to anything are simple especially when it comes to football which is why I posted what Bedard said. I know he is respected around here for his football insights even if he has gotten on the hot take train the past couple of seasons.

You do realize that you completed contradicted yourself when you said that all I did was argue Cam was the main issue last year (which I did) and then turn around and say I agree with Bedard when he said it was defensive coaching because it fits my confirmation bias. LOL. So which is it? Perhaps, you need to go back and read again what I posted.

And in terms of this line "are you ever going form your own opinions or is every point you ever make just the latest talking point from the poison pens of the media?" I have to say I LOL'd for a long time. As anyone on this board will tell you, I have my own opinions separate from anyone least of all the media.
 
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