Looking at the Patriots - 2021

I don't understand why the voters seem to have a prejudice against guys that played a NT-type role most of their career when that job isn't particularly conducive to generating stats. Vince had a career that also compared favorably to Ted Washington, who I consider the best NT of all time.

Big Ted:

tackles 693 combined, 538 solo, 34.5 sacks and 8 FFs.

They all deserve the Hall, but Washington should get the nod first over Vince, imo. I suppose guys that pile up sack numbers are sexier to the voters, but that doesn't necessarily make them better football players.
 
I don't understand why the voters seem to have a prejudice against guys that played a NT-type role most of their career when that job isn't particularly conducive to generating stats. Vince had a career that also compared favorably to Ted Washington, who I consider the best NT of all time.

Big Ted:

tackles 693 combined, 538 solo, 34.5 sacks and 8 FFs.

They all deserve the Hall, but Washington should get the nod first over Vince, imo. I suppose guys that pile up sack numbers are sexier to the voters, but that doesn't necessarily make them better football players.
Hear bloody hear.
 
I don't understand why the voters seem to have a prejudice against guys that played a NT-type role most of their career when that job isn't particularly conducive to generating stats. Vince had a career that also compared favorably to Ted Washington, who I consider the best NT of all time.

Big Ted:

tackles 693 combined, 538 solo, 34.5 sacks and 8 FFs.

They all deserve the Hall, but Washington should get the nod first over Vince, imo. I suppose guys that pile up sack numbers are sexier to the voters, but that doesn't necessarily make them better football players.
Ted should have been first ballot.

Only 12 pure DTs have made the HOF, but only 38 total DL have made it.
 
in 2010 I was really hoping that the Pats would take either Gronkowski or Hernandez. I was ecstatic.
 
This. Tackles who get in have sacks. All the recent have
of sacks. Vince doesn't

Talk about your graphic pecking order ...
DT and NT (which Vince mainly played) are different though. NT's won't have the numbers because if weren't for them occupying 2 OL the DT wouldn't get the glory..lol Seriously though, I think NT is an extremely overlooked and under rated position. Heloti Ngata was another very under rated NT, who really made the Ravens look even better. It is amazing what a solid NT can do for a defensive front 7.
 
DT and NT (which Vince mainly played) are different though. NT's won't have the numbers because if weren't for them occupying 2 OL the DT wouldn't get the glory..lol Seriously though, I think NT is an extremely overlooked and under rated position. Heloti Ngata was another very under rated NT, who really made the Ravens look even better. It is amazing what a solid NT can do for a defensive front 7.
I think its one of those positions where it’s the coaches who really value the position in contrast to the general fans and the media. The real die hard fan will recognise it as well. I don’t have the knowledge of the game that many here have. I can simply recognise the logic of the value of a good NT. It’s like the tighthead prop in rugby whose job is to anchor the scrum. It’s an unheralded position but if the tighthead prop is not up to the job, the whole scrum is in trouble and more times than not, the team will lose as they’re constantly on the back foot and losing possession and being penalised. It seems to be the same with the NT position. If you don’t have a seriously good NT, the interior line outside him will get no pressure inside as the offensive line can simply focus around the NT and the team will also be killed by the running game.
 
Wilfork was one of a kind. There are few guys in NFL history who could do every week what he was tasked with. It was rarely glorious, but incredibly important.

Still though through a lot of his best years we were on here every day asking “can he rush the passer” about any possible new Patriot. It’s a shame they couldn’t find a way to get more pressure and support around him during those years from 09 till the end of his term as a Patriot.
 
One more word on Vince. I remember Bill saying when Vince retired that Bill actually awarded his wife Bianca, a famous Patriots Ironman t-shirt at the end of one particular camp. She was heavily pregnant yet was at every day of camp supporting Vince, (and the team) and gave birth and was back at camp 2 days later! The Ironman award is for players who never miss a day in camp and just worked their tails off every day. It's an important award for Bill and as he said, he simply had to give the T-Shirt to Bianca.

Bills tells the stroy.


View: https://youtu.be/_6oz_a3xFUM
 
Not really, Winovich was a solid pick, Harry? Not so much..lol
Still hoping he can pick up his game on running plays... else he will continue to be a liability in those situations, if hes on the field
 
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