LT/Oline Watch 2025

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Big/Sky/Fly said:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kh_hruvpOoI
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I just have a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach they're not going to draft any of them.

I don't mean to be 'old man yells at cloud', but Elliot Wolf/Jonathan Kraft et al decided that this group at offensive line would be fine enough to play a professional football season with.

I've watched the Patriots (and remember them at least) since 1981. I remember the 1990 season vividly, and many bad seasons in between.

They have NEVER sent out an offensive line, where three of the five players could not pass block. And I don't mean 'bad at pass blocking', I mean 'incapable of pass blocking'. Every pass play, there are three instant defeats on the offensive line - both guards, and left tackle. And more often than not, you can throw center in there as well.

They're not exactly run-blocking well either, that's at least not INSTANT defeats on every play, just eventual defeats on every play. What Rhamondre Stevenson is doing right now is the best performance by a running back I've seen from a Patriot since Curtis Martin. Almost every single yard he's gained this season has been after contact. That's absolutely NOT how it's supposed to be.

Everyone glazed the QB class from this year, and pretended there were no QBs available next year. To me there are at least 3 10-year pros available at QB next year. They didn't take the trade down package, that would have gotten them either WR talent, or a long-term starter at left tackle, with MORE picks next year to solidify things even more.

At this point, Drake Maye had better be John Elway (remember his first couple of years running for his life), because not DRAFTING pro-level linemen, and not SIGNING pro-level linemen, while drafting 2 receivers, and having 50 million in cap space, is utter malpractice. And this isn't a 2nd guess, either. This isn't getting better. Even if Cole Strange comes back, that still leaves 2-3 spots that CAN NOT PASS BLOCK.

Pop Douglas has 3 targets in 2 games. That has nothing to do with gameplan. He's a SLOT receiver. He runs really quick routes. Brissett doesn't even have the time to get him the ball. Can the Bournes get open? WHO KNOWS? You need more than 0 seconds to at least give them a chance. Should be able to dominate with playaction because of how good the run game is, right? NOPE, instant defeats just lead to exposing Brissett to injury with his back to the defense. That's where we are now. And nobody's coming to save the day. I can't blame the coaches, the Bournes, Brissett - this is a personnel failure.
 
HAMMERMILL said:
Thanks for posting, I wanted Campbell from LSU but after watching this makes me reconsider .
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I said it in the college football thread. I will take any of the Miami Hurricane's top 6 offensive linemen (All freshmen and sophomores, mind), over 4 of the 5 starters on the Patriots offensive line, right now.
 
TommyD420 said:
I said it in the college football thread. I will take any of the Miami Hurricane's top 6 offensive linemen (All freshmen and sophomores, mind), over 4 of the 5 starters on the Patriots offensive line, right now.
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Ok makes me wonder which one are you keeping Andrews Or Onwenu ? I'm going to guess Onwenu just based on age .
 
HAMMERMILL said:
Ok makes me wonder which one are you keeping Andrews Or Onwenu ? I'm going to guess Onwenu just based on age .
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Oh Onwenu, clearly. I think Andrews is cooked, and is hanging on by a thread right now, because he has the barest minimum of competence at his job.

And Flagg's right - I don't want to come off like I'm praising Onwenu, he has looked like ass on several plays, run and pass, in both games so far, and a move back to guard would probably be in order if it were possible. But he looks like ass in a normal way for an NFL offensive lineman. As in, he makes contact with the defender across from him on pass plays at the very least, and isn't instantly defeated and beaten. This makes him head and shoulders better than the rest of the starting offensive line.

This is where we are right now.
 
Can someone explain how and why the team messed up the O-line so badly? It seems the most obvious thing in coaching: get your O-line right and build from the inside out. Even a football dummy like me knows this and knows how the great teams in history all had stellar O-lines. I mean, Walter Jones made Matt Hasselback look like Joe Montana and made Shaun Alexander look like Walter Payton.

How can a coaching team with so many resources at its disposal get this so wrong? Is it the lack of availability of quality O Lineman, issues with salary caps, or is it just negligence?
 
Roberto71 said:
Can someone explain how and why the team messed up the O-line so badly? It seems the most obvious thing in coaching: get your O-line right and build from the inside out. Even a football dummy like me knows this and knows how the great teams in history all had stellar O-lines. I mean, Walter Jones made Matt Hasselback look like Joe Montana and made Shaun Alexander look like Walter Payton.

How can a coaching team with so many resources at its disposal get this so wrong? Is it the lack of availability of quality O Lineman, issues with salary caps, or is it just negligence?
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Well one, there's no issues with salary caps. They're 50 million under the cap right now, started the offseason 100 million under.

They messed it up by letting Trent Brown walk (although I assume he was going anyway), misdiagnosing whatever is wrong with Cole Strange, and passing on even semi-competent OLinemen in free agency, bringing in the absolute bottom-of-the-dumpster-barely-in-the-league types.

In the draft, they decided to panic and take a QB, instead of trading back for a big package, and drafting a tackle, and took their next two picks on wide receivers, before finally addressing the offensive line, drafting a guard they want to eventually convert to tackle, and then drafted another guard they want to make a tackle. These were all in rounds 4 and later, where even making a team is a crap shoot.

Perhaps some of it is 'perfect being the enemy of the good'? Trent Brown isn't a great player anymore, neither is McGlinchey, but at least they're tackles and can play the position with the barest of competence. However, not addressing tackle in rounds 2 and 3, if you're absolutely committed to taking the QB in the first, is complete malpractice.

And it all boils down to the owner taking the absolute cheapest route possible. Brady and Belichick were both spackle here, they covered up a lot of holes and flaws over 20 years that were here because the owner didn't want to spend money. That cover is gone now.
 
TommyD420 said:
Well one, there's no issues with salary caps. They're 50 million under the cap right now, started the offseason 100 million under.

They messed it up by letting Trent Brown walk (although I assume he was going anyway), misdiagnosing whatever is wrong with Cole Strange, and passing on even semi-competent OLinemen in free agency, bringing in the absolute bottom-of-the-dumpster-barely-in-the-league types.

In the draft, they decided to panic and take a QB, instead of trading back for a big package, and drafting a tackle, and took their next two picks on wide receivers, before finally addressing the offensive line, drafting a guard they want to eventually convert to tackle, and then drafted another guard they want to make a tackle. These were all in rounds 4 and later, where even making a team is a crap shoot.

Perhaps some of it is 'perfect being the enemy of the good'? Trent Brown isn't a great player anymore, neither is McGlinchey, but at least they're tackles and can play the position with the barest of competence. However, not addressing tackle in rounds 2 and 3, if you're absolutely committed to taking the QB in the first, is complete malpractice.

And it all boils down to the owner taking the absolute cheapest route possible. Brady and Belichick were both spackle here, they covered up a lot of holes and flaws over 20 years that were here because the owner didn't want to spend money. That cover is gone now.
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Bingo, what gets me is i saw people saying how much they loved this draft.
 
TommyD420 said:
Well one, there's no issues with salary caps. They're 50 million under the cap right now, started the offseason 100 million under.

They messed it up by letting Trent Brown walk (although I assume he was going anyway), misdiagnosing whatever is wrong with Cole Strange, and passing on even semi-competent OLinemen in free agency, bringing in the absolute bottom-of-the-dumpster-barely-in-the-league types.

In the draft, they decided to panic and take a QB, instead of trading back for a big package, and drafting a tackle, and took their next two picks on wide receivers, before finally addressing the offensive line, drafting a guard they want to eventually convert to tackle, and then drafted another guard they want to make a tackle. These were all in rounds 4 and later, where even making a team is a crap shoot.

Perhaps some of it is 'perfect being the enemy of the good'? Trent Brown isn't a great player anymore, neither is McGlinchey, but at least they're tackles and can play the position with the barest of competence. However, not addressing tackle in rounds 2 and 3, if you're absolutely committed to taking the QB in the first, is complete malpractice.

And it all boils down to the owner taking the absolute cheapest route possible. Brady and Belichick were both spackle here, they covered up a lot of holes and flaws over 20 years that were here because the owner didn't want to spend money. That cover is gone now.
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That all seems very accurate and on the money.
 
HAMMERMILL said:
What would it cost to get SCAR back as a consultant just to provide training Information ?

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjNkl0z-c0s
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Honestly, for as great of a coach as he is, I don't think it would make much of a difference. In order to be 'coached up', you have to have at least some basic skill at your job. 3 of the 5 starters on the offensive line have not even shown that ability. "Don't get knocked on your ass at the snap" isn't much of a coaching point.
 
TommyD420 said:
Honestly, for as great of a coach as he is, I don't think it would make much of a difference. In order to be 'coached up', you have to have at least some basic skill at your job. 3 of the 5 starters on the offensive line have not even shown that ability. "Don't get knocked on your ass at the snap" isn't much of a coaching point.
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I get what your saying, Guess just trying to hang on to glory days.... But he "technically is allowed to suit up right " ? ;)
In all seriousness he gave his line all the Info on how they were going to be attacked ,gave them the best chance to succeed.
Maybe that's why they did ?
 
HAMMERMILL said:
I get what your saying, Guess just trying to hang on to glory days.... But he "technically is allowed to suit up right " ? ;)
In all seriousness he gave his line all the Info on how they were going to be attacked ,gave them the best chance to succeed.
Maybe that's why they did ?
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He did, and they did wonders with some below average offensive lines. Some key difference though, is even with the below average lines, there was still at least one really good player on those lines, which made is easier to adjust everything to that strength, and most of the time he had Tom Brady under center.

Neither of those things are true now, and while Mike Onwenu has just been regular bad, and not embarrassingly bad - he proved last week that a) he's playing out of position, and b) you can't even count on him for average play week-to-week.

I don't know if I'm expressing that right. Mike Onwenu has just been bottom-20 right tackle in the NFL bad. Lowe, Jordan and Robinson have been laughing-stock, shouldn't-be-in-the-league, historically bad, displaying not even the barest minimum of skill to be on an NFL field.

And Drake Maye had better end up as a top-5-in the league QB, because Joe Alt looks fucking fantastic right now. And he's playing. Right now.
 
TommyD420 said:
Well one, there's no issues with salary caps. They're 50 million under the cap right now, started the offseason 100 million under.

They messed it up by letting Trent Brown walk (although I assume he was going anyway), misdiagnosing whatever is wrong with Cole Strange, and passing on even semi-competent OLinemen in free agency, bringing in the absolute bottom-of-the-dumpster-barely-in-the-league types.

In the draft, they decided to panic and take a QB, instead of trading back for a big package, and drafting a tackle, and took their next two picks on wide receivers, before finally addressing the offensive line, drafting a guard they want to eventually convert to tackle, and then drafted another guard they want to make a tackle. These were all in rounds 4 and later, where even making a team is a crap shoot.

Perhaps some of it is 'perfect being the enemy of the good'? Trent Brown isn't a great player anymore, neither is McGlinchey, but at least they're tackles and can play the position with the barest of competence. However, not addressing tackle in rounds 2 and 3, if you're absolutely committed to taking the QB in the first, is complete malpractice.

And it all boils down to the owner taking the absolute cheapest route possible. Brady and Belichick were both spackle here, they covered up a lot of holes and flaws over 20 years that were here because the owner didn't want to spend money. That cover is gone now.
Click to expand...

What gets me is the JETE almost completely rebuilt their OL this off season adding Tyron Smith, Morgan Moses (both top 10 OTs in 2023) and John Smith for $15M total and the Patriots did next to nothing.
 
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chevss454 said:
What gets me is the JETE almost completely rebuilt their OL this off season adding Tyron Smith, Morgan Moses and John Smith for $15M total and the Patriots did next to nothing.
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If the Patriots had grossly overpaid for Tyron Smith, this would be a playoff team. It's disgusting. Unless the intention was to not be a playoff team.
 
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