Week 7, 49ers at Patriots

[foobahl]

I'm really not defending BB. I'm laying out the circumstances as they were.
The situation has everything to do with Brady and his contract. If he'd have played for free I'm quite certain he'd still be here.
Do you really think BB would have drafted LJackson with a 1st round pick? I mean, he's not exactly a fit in our O.

No I don't think BB would draft Jackson, but isn't that pretty much the scenario with Cam?

 

[Big/Sky/Fly]

I'm really not defending BB. I'm laying out the circumstances as they were.
The situation has everything to do with Brady and his contract. If he'd have played for free I'm quite certain he'd still be here.
Do you really think BB would have drafted LJackson with a 1st round pick? I mean, he's not exactly a fit in our O.

Drafting a running back that high is reaching...but, Michel.

 

[chevss454]

No I don't think BB would draft Jackson, but isn't that pretty much the scenario with Cam?

I don't think so. Cam went 2-0 against Brady in previous contests. Cam also made a great receiver out of Kelvin Benjamin. Cam can throw better than LJackson.
Plus, Cam was available & signed on the cheap.

 

[chevss454]

Drafting a running back that high is reaching...but, Michel.

Yeah, that choice was thought provoking but he did help us out greatly his first year.

 

[Patriots71]

I don't think so. Cam went 2-0 against Brady in previous contests. Cam also made a great receiver out of Kelvin Benjamin. Cam can throw better than LJackson.
Plus, Cam was available & signed on the cheap.

Well unless Cam was playing ping pong against Brady, not sure why that is a good reason. I give a linebacker bear hug as more of a reason for the second loss. Pats never play running QB's well. Not sure that was a good reason. but..he was cheap.

 

[Big/Sky/Fly]

Yeah, that choice was thought provoking but he did help us out greatly his first year.

Are his knees completely toast now?

 

[Patriots71]

Are his knees completely toast now?

backs are a complete crap shoot. They might last 1 year 5 years or 10 years. That is not a position of longevity.

 

[chevss454]

Well unless Cam was playing ping pong against Brady, not sure why that is a good reason. I give a linebacker bear hug as more of a reason for the second loss. Pats never play running QB's well. Not sure that was a good reason. but..he was cheap.

AND he was available.

 

[Patriots71]

AND he was available.

I will still contend that I would rather have started stidham to see what we had with him and if we needed to move on and I said that before he played a down here. Thats just how I see it. There are about 20 teams in football that run out and grab players trying to win now and some players get lost in the shuffle. I didnt want Stidham to get lost in the shuffle because of a pipe dream of winning a superbowl with Cam, because the idea was remote, and if the idea was remote, then what was the point? I am at the point now where if something is not done to win a superbowl then it does not help us. Its like in the NBA where you have to either be really good or really bad, the middle teams stay in the middle. I could not see a 31 year old QB who's best asset is running coming off shoulder surgery as sustainable for 3,4, or 5 years.

 

[Mazz22]

It has to do with Brady like it or not, because that cap hit was big enough to make it difficult to lure in a veteran QB to replace him while still keeping him on the roster. Also, while being contenders, does it sound like BB to move up in the draft to draft a QB while you have the best to ever do it there? That's just not how BB operates.

But that is exactly what Bill did when Brady was 37. He drafted Jimmy and then Brissett. He said back then it was better to be early on the Qb position than late. Brady was 40 in 2017 and clearly Bill did not believe he was elite anymore as he was on a year to year basis. So Brady is 40, 41, 42 and you don't draft his replacement? What sense does that make? You only spend a 7 and a 4 in three drafts??

 

[foobahl]

I will still contend that I would rather have started stidham to see what we had with him and if we needed to move on and I said that before he played a down here. Thats just how I see it. There are about 20 teams in football that run out and grab players trying to win now and some players get lost in the shuffle. I didnt want Stidham to get lost in the shuffle because of a pipe dream of winning a superbowl with Cam, because the idea was remote, and if the idea was remote, then what was the point? I am at the point now where if something is not done to win a superbowl then it does not help us. Its like in the NBA where you have to either be really good or really bad, the middle teams stay in the middle. I could not see a 31 year old QB who's best asset is running coming off shoulder surgery as sustainable for 3,4, or 5 years.

I just hope that if we lose this week, by any amount, we try JFS. I don't count style points in football.

 

[chevss454]

A franchise QB has to be taken in the top of the draft otherwise it's just a crap shoot.

You can fault BB for not selling all his draft capital in one of the previous 3 years to get a top 5 pick but I don't.
I do take issue with the weapons at WR and TE he's chosen. That's where we should be looking rather than QB imo.
Great receivers make mediocre QBs look great. There's plenty of evidence over the years for that.

 

[SkiptoMyLou]

But that is exactly what Bill did when Brady was 37. He drafted Jimmy and then Brissett. He said back then it was better to be early on the Qb position than late. Brady was 40 in 2017 and clearly Bill did not believe he was elite anymore as he was on a year to year basis. So Brady is 40, 41, 42 and you don't draft his replacement? What sense does that make? You only spend a 7 and a 4 in three drafts??

Keep in mind BB tried to trade Brady and Kraft basically vetoed that trade, so I think that limited BB on what he could do considering Brady had control of his own destiny so to speak. That meant that those last years Brady could have opted out anytime since he was on a flexible contract, and BB couldn't do much about it other than try to do it through the draft. The inevitable happened and BB didn't have enough cap room to do anything about it. It's just a tough situation to be in.

 

[3 Point Stan]

I will still contend that I would rather have started stidham to see what we had with him and if we needed to move on and I said that before he played a down here. Thats just how I see it. There are about 20 teams in football that run out and grab players trying to win now and some players get lost in the shuffle. I didnt want Stidham to get lost in the shuffle because of a pipe dream of winning a superbowl with Cam, because the idea was remote, and if the idea was remote, then what was the point? I am at the point now where if something is not done to win a superbowl then it does not help us. Its like in the NBA where you have to either be really good or really bad, the middle teams stay in the middle. I could not see a 31 year old QB who's best asset is running coming off shoulder surgery as sustainable for 3,4, or 5 years.

I was hoping that Bill felt Stidham was ready to ascend to the starting role, and that it factored mightily into the organization's decision to let Brady leave without much of a fight. But upon the Cam signing, one thing was 100% clear to me the moment I learned of it: In BB's eyes, Stidham is simply not ready. Will that be the case by season's end? We may all be finding out together at some point.

 

[rivshark86]

Come on with this cam going 2 and against Brady. Let’s look at their respective records of win losses in general.
Cam 73 wins, 62 losses.
Brady 254 wins 77 losses

If it were not for one outstanding season cams .500 at best.
I’m not trying to attack him for this year. With the putrid talent around him no one could succeed. But to compare him favorably to Brady???? To expect a playoff run, or heck even appearance? To expect anything but a losing season was foolish.

You have to much faith in Belichick. He’s been wrong on most personal moves for 4 years.

And 50 6th round RBs could have run through the holes Sony had his first year. Especially when the line got healthy in the playoffs.

 

[Patriots71]

A franchise QB has to be taken in the top of the draft otherwise it's just a crap shoot.

You can fault BB for not selling all his draft capital in one of the previous 3 years to get a top 5 pick but I don't.
I do take issue with the weapons at WR and TE he's chosen. That's where we should be looking rather than QB imo.
Great receivers make mediocre QBs look great. There's plenty of evidence over the years for that.

Sometimes, I mean tampa had great weapons last year and their QB threw 30 ints.

 

[Patriots71]

Keep in mind BB tried to trade Brady and Kraft basically vetoed that trade, so I think that limited BB on what he could do considering Brady had control of his own destiny so to speak. That meant that those last years Brady could have opted out anytime since he was on a flexible contract, and BB couldn't do much about it other than try to do it through the draft. The inevitable happened and BB didn't have enough cap room to do anything about it. It's just a tough situation to be in.

it was smart to veto that trade, but he didnt stop him from trying to find a replacement for when Brady was ready to go. But yes he was in a tough situation, but the tough situation was trying to say, oh no that Qb that just won mvp and took us to two superbowls needs to go so I can see if this other person can even make it in the NFL.

 

[Patriots71]

I was hoping that Bill felt Stidham was ready to ascend to the starting role, and that it factored mightily into the organization's decision to let Brady leave without much of a fight. But upon the Cam signing, one thing was 100% clear to me the moment I learned of it: In BB's eyes, Stidham is simply not ready. Will that be the case by season's end? We may all be finding out together at some point.

Yeah I dont know on that one. I mean he said in his book that he didnt think Brady was ready and then all the of the sudden Bledsoe went down and then he is ready? I mean has Stidham looked worse really? I am not sure.

 

[Roberto71]

I will still contend that I would rather have started stidham to see what we had with him and if we needed to move on and I said that before he played a down here. Thats just how I see it. There are about 20 teams in football that run out and grab players trying to win now and some players get lost in the shuffle. I didnt want Stidham to get lost in the shuffle because of a pipe dream of winning a superbowl with Cam, because the idea was remote, and if the idea was remote, then what was the point? I am at the point now where if something is not done to win a superbowl then it does not help us. Its like in the NBA where you have to either be really good or really bad, the middle teams stay in the middle. I could not see a 31 year old QB who's best asset is running coming off shoulder surgery as sustainable for 3,4, or 5 years.

It was never remote. Cam is a top tier QB, someone who set all kinds of records in college, got the better of Saban and co and set records when he came into the league. A league MVP and got the panthers to the SB. This is not a journeyman QB. He was available and cheap and Bill was 100% correct to have gone out to get him. The downside to the deal was minute.

 

[Roberto71]

Come on with this cam going 2 and against Brady. Let’s look at their respective records of win losses in general.
Cam 73 wins, 62 losses.
Brady 254 wins 77 losses

If it were not for one outstanding season cams .500 at best.
I’m not trying to attack him for this year. With the putrid talent around him no one could succeed. But to compare him favorably to Brady???? To expect a playoff run, or heck even appearance? To expect anything but a losing season was foolish.

You have to much faith in Belichick. He’s been wrong on most personal moves for 4 years.

And 50 6th round RBs could have run through the holes Sony had his first year. Especially when the line got healthy in the playoffs.

The four years that garnered 2 superbowls?