Just a thought....Travis Henry in a Patriot's uniform in '04?

[Steve1]

Here's my yahoo trade possibility (sometime after the '03 season): One of the Pat's number one picks straight up for Travis Henry. Yeah, I know, it'll probably never happen. Just like 99.99% of everyone's guesses on this year's draft probably never happenned. But think about it-Buffalo will have McGahee as their probable #1 back in '04, with no need for Travis Henry and his contract. And, Travis Henry is a hell of a runningback, and the Pat's will probably still need a new back in '04. Looks like Antoinne Smith is our back for '03, with Faulk again as third-down ammo.

One last comment-could McGahee be the starting back in Foxboro in our last regular-season game, for Buffalo? With Seymour and Warren stopping him cold, and sacking Drewskie? We'll see.

 

[mrsteel]

Here's my yahoo trade possibility (sometime after the '03 season): One of the Pat's number one picks straight up for Travis Henry. Yeah, I know, it'll probably never happen. Just like 99.99% of everyone's guesses on this year's draft probably never happenned. But think about it-Buffalo will have McGahee as their probable #1 back in '04, with no need for Travis Henry and his contract. And, Travis Henry is a hell of a runningback, and the Pat's will probably still need a new back in '04. Looks like Antoinne Smith is our back for '03, with Faulk again as third-down ammo.

One last comment-could McGahee be the starting back in Foxboro in our last regular-season game, for Buffalo? With Seymour and Warren stopping him cold, and sacking Drewskie? We'll see.

ANTOWAIN !!!! it is ANTOWAIN !!!

am I the only one who likes the guy!

 

[Peg]

Re: Re: Just a thought....Travis Henry in a Patriot's uniform in '04?

ANTOWAIN !!!! it is ANTOWAIN !!!

am I the only one who likes the guy!

Mr.Steel--
Carm down, man, carm down!...
I, too, like A.Smith... (more on that, later...)

But, it is a bit uncanny, as just yesterday, at our Pats Fan gathering in MA, COOKIEinCOLLEGE was also saying somthing along the lines of Steve's post here...
My counter was, Yeah, but--didn't Buffalo JUST re-sign Travis Henry to a (relatively) long-term, lucrative contract, recently?!?!... But, then Buff goes ahead and signs Olandis Gary in Free Agency and then drafts Willis McGahee?!?!... What's up with all of that?!...

Either way--it looks like a win-win situation for us, IMHO...
Either McGahee is a BUST and therefore Buffalo wasted their pick (where they should of/could of picked a WR to replace Peerless Price) or else, they end up with extra, unneeded RBs that we might be able to pick up for a relatively bargain price, if we play our cards right... Regardless---Buffalo didn't really improve their stance in this draft for this upcoming season... Therefore---I LIKE our chances of continuing to take two from them in our division in the 2003 season...

So, what say ye?!...
And yeah---I know that Buffalo picked up some solid FAs like Takeo Spikes in the off-season, but BB STILL has Drew's number and I STILL have my rose-colored glasses, firmly in place!...

p.s.--and after COOKIE'S predictions on the draft, I am thinking that COOKIE is a pretty Smart Cookie and I am inclined to agree... (at this juncture...)

 

[COOKIEINCOLLEGE]

you've got it half right peg !!!

p.s.--and after COOKIE'S predictions on the draft, I am thinking that COOKIE is a pretty Smart Cookie and I am inclined to agree... (at this juncture...)

That was the right part!!

Seriously though, I also like Antowain but think a guy that can get "around the corner" is a better fit for our style of offense and misdirection/quick plays. I don't think Henry will be in our realm of possibility next year anyways. Buffalo, Tampa, and two or three other teams (Steelers a possibility depending on how amos fares because the bus is broken for good) will be looking hard at this guy. He's going to rush for another 1400-1550 yards this year. I think we'll use next years draft to get Maurice Clarett. We have the ammo to move wherever we need to get this guy and he'll definetly be coming out if he comes back strong after the injury bug hit him a little this year. 2 #1's, 2 #2's, 3 #4's and alot more to come if we know BB as far as picks for next year go.

By the way though, Henry got an extension for one year more than his original deal so it wasn't a block buster deal everyone is making it sound like. His pay for next year is 1.25 million and his cap hit against Buffalo is only 425,000 so it wouldn't surprise me if they keep him if they don't think McGahee may stay healthy or the trade offers aren't what they think they should be.

Oh, yeah you remember the Bledsoe deal. That will be what Buffalo is looking for with Henry in the offseason to trade him away. He's worth a number one pick next year but only if we can get an o-line to run block for him or whoever we have. It all starts with the hogs up front and they way they 've been getting hurt in NE for the past 3-4 years the line looks more like piglets and eeyores than the hogs we need them to be

 

[Guest]

Re: you've got it half right peg !!!

It all starts with the hogs up front and they way they 've been getting hurt in NE for the past 3-4 years the line looks more like piglets and eeyores than the hogs we need them to be.

Cookie:

All good points on Henry. I am worried about McGahee joining an AFC East team but right now I am enjoying the idea of how disruptive his selection will be for the team chemistry of the Bills. Already, Henry has become publicly defensive about his role and the Bills organization has been quick to try to put out the fires. However, just because the Bills have managed to assuage Henry's agent doesn't mean that all is right with Travis Henry. That pick might be great for the Bills in the long run but it may be trouble for them next year. I expect that the pick could be unsettling enough for Henry to eventually make him request a trade. There will be constant pressure on him this year knowing that McGahee is waiting in the wings. What better salve for that wound than signing with an AFC East rival?

I'm not big on Henry, but Belichick always likes guys with something to prove. I would rather see the position addressed in other ways, and the O-line is still a shambles but I wouldn't be surprised if it ends up being considered given how incestuous things have become in the division. Personally I would take my chances in the draft rather than make that trade.

http://www.boston.com/dailynews/117/sports/McGahee_s_addition_ruffles_Hen:.shtml

 

[Steve1]

Just so you guys know....

I would give Kevin Faulk first crack as the starting back this coming season. I mean, he really proved himself last year. Very few fumbles, very good speed, etc. Of course, they've never really used him much as the feature back, so I admit, it is a question mark right now. And I will always like Antoinne Smith for getting the touqh yards in our SB-winning season (not to mention, he is still a halfway-decent running back). Now, I used to be Very afraid when Faulk would run back kickoffs, etc.., because he was way too fumble-prone. But I think he proved last season that he is over the "dropsies" (notwithstanding his inaction toward the "lateral" against the Packers), and he has a real knack for picking up speed, and getting many yards per run. And Antoinne Smith just didn't have it last year-or was it just the inconsistent line-play, play-calling, all-around execution of the offense (even though they started out like gangbusters)? So, who the heck knows, I guess. Hopefully the Pats coaches know.

 

[COOKIEINCOLLEGE]

I'm sorry but any team with Faulk....

I would give Kevin Faulk first crack as the starting back this coming season. I mean, he really proved himself last year. Very few fumbles, very good speed, etc. Of course, they've never really used him much as the feature back, so I admit, it is a question mark right now. Quote from Steve1

....as their starting running back is doomed for failure in my opinion. He can not, has not, and never will be an every down back. I will agree that he was our best back last year, but did you notice that most of his yards were runs around the corner and could be considered garbage time yards? I have all the tapes. Most of his plays were when it didn't matter anymore. I also don't think we used the run enough last year especially with Smith. His average was still about 3.9-4 yards per carry but he only got the ball 15 times a game.

We all know this was because of playing from behind and also because the line couldn't run block against Curry College.(shameless Steve Nelson plug )

Kevin Faulk will never be the answer. With that said if for some reason our line can't open some holes in the middle of the trenches again this year Faulk will AGAIN be our best chance for ground yards. Just like last year, though, those yards will be sweeps and pitches and not up the gut. The Pats hardly ever senf Faulk up the middle when he runs because he still has fumblitis. He may not have had it last year, but thats because he didn't run up the middle. Faulks a great special teams guy and a great 3rd down back but he will never be good enough as an every down back to take us anywhere near a SB.

 

[Steve1]

Yeah, and the Patriots will never win the championship, but they did

And the Celts will never win against Indi, but they will.

Now as far as Faulk not being able to run up the middle last year, WHO COULD? Their run blocking was just attrocious. Now, gee I wonder, was Faulk an everyday back in college? Well sure, it aint the pro's, but I do faintly remember Faulk setting a few college rushing records. And in his first 2 pro seasons, the Pat's couldn't run block worth a damn. They finally could in 2001-although I wiill gladly admit that Antoinne Smith gritted out many tough yards that season-something that Faulk never proved himself at up to that point. But I say Faulk came into his own last year, and will be a new man this year (just a guess). So sure, you (and admittedly, many others) say Faulk is just a third-down, around the end back. No problem. Who really cares, as long as we win, right? But I say Faulk was twice the runner Antoinne Smith was last year. Just look at his great kickoff returns. If he gets any kind of an opening, he is off to the races, and Antoinne ain't. But again, Antoinne can sure pick up that tough 2-3 yards like a poor-mans bull. And Faulk is not that type of player. So, we'll just have to wait and see. And IMHO, Antoinne Womack-quite a longshot (6th rounder, right?).

And if the Pat's CAN open up some holes, I want the back who will gain 17 yards, not the one who can gain 9 yards-guess I'm greedy-or maybe I'm getting Kevin Faulk mixed up with Marshall Faulk, eh?

 

[Steve1]

Of course, I could be 100% wrong!

And I will be doing cartwheels and screaming "Yahoo" if and when Antoinne Smith rushes for 1400 yards this year. Do it, Antoinne!

 

[Undertaker #59*]

I'm hoping Womack turns out to be the "diamond in the rough".......he certainly did well for me as a starting back in Madden 03

 

[pookie]

I'm hoping Womack turns out to be the "diamond in the rough".......he certainly did well for me as a starting back in Madden 03

Me too chief... what a nice problem that would be to have. At the very least Womack should provide some competition at the tailback spot in camp. Last season Smith was dumb, fat and happy. That can't be the case this season. It won't be allowed.

 

[Peg]

Re: you've got it half right peg !!!

Originally posted by COOKIEINCOLLEGE p.s.--and after COOKIE'S predictions on the draft, I am thinking that COOKIE is a pretty Smart Cookie and I am inclined to agree... (at this juncture...)

That was the right part!!

HA-HA---you are funny!
----------------------------------------------


...I think we'll use next years draft to get Maurice Clarett. We have the ammo to move wherever we need to get this guy and he'll definetly be coming out if he comes back strong after the injury bug hit him a little this year.

HEY--I'LL NEVER DOUBT YOU AGAIN, KIDDO!!
If you say so, then it will most likely happen!...
(And btw--is THAT why Joe got up and did a jig, when we traded our number 19 pick with Baltimore for their first pick next year?!?!) Hee-hee!
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It all starts with the hogs up front and they way they 've been getting hurt in NE for the past 3-4 years the line looks more like piglets and eeyores than the hogs we need them to be

RIGHT YOU ARE (AGAIN!)!!... And just WHAT IS UP with all of the Winnie the Pooh references, lately? I can't seem to go anywhere these days and not have someone refer to them, in some way... So, in the immortal words of Tigger, I say: "TTFN!"

 

[patriotmarty12]

All I know is this, the O line last year was not healthy all year therefore, not much consistency from the running game, bet that don't happen this year and bet, A Smith don't flunk his run this year either, with a greater emphasis on the run this year and the other RB's on this team I am willing to go out on the limb and say the Pat's running game will be in the top 15 in the league which along with the passing game will make the Pats very dangerous....

 

[freak]

Faulk again as third-down ammo.

FYI.......

A mere 8 of Faulk's 52 carries last year came on 3rd down.

Only 9 of Faulk's 37 catches came on 3rd down.

In other words........

84.6% of Faulk's carries came on 1st and 2nd down.

75.7% of Faulk's catches came on 1st and 2nd down.

 

[freak]

Re: Just so you guys know....

Now, I used to be Very afraid when Faulk would run back kickoffs, etc.., because he was way too fumble-prone.

FYI......

Faulk has had only 1 fumble each of the past TWO years.

 

[freak]

Re: I'm sorry but any team with Faulk....

....as their starting running back is doomed for failure in my opinion. He can not, has not, and never will be an every down back.

He's never been given the chance.

I will agree that he was our best back last year, but did you notice that most of his yards were runs around the corner and could be considered garbage time yards?

Simply not true. Only 11 of 52 carries last year were classified as going wide left or right. By contrast, 10 of 52 carries went up the gut. He had 14 and 17 carries go right and left respectively, which suggests off tackle. Off tackle is often misinterpreted too....it really refers to off "defensive" tackle.

Kevin Faulk will never be the answer.

Yeah, sorta tough to prove yourself when your coach slots you into a role, before holding a single practice.

Just like last year, though, those yards will be sweeps and pitches and not up the gut.

See above. Simply not true.

The Pats hardly ever senf Faulk up the middle when he runs because he still has fumblitis. He may not have had it last year, but thats because he didn't run up the middle. Faulks a great special teams guy and a great 3rd down back but he will never be good enough as an every down back to take us anywhere near a SB.

1. Faulk has had 1 fumble each of the past two years.

2. He ran up the gut 1 fewer times than he ran wide TOTAL (left or right) last year.

3. Faulk had a combined 17 touches on 3rd down last year, out of 89 total touches (rsh/rec). Further, 23 of his carries last year were in situations of 1st and 8-10 yards.

This idea that Faulk is simply a 3rd down back is not born out by the facts.

 

[freak]

Re: Yeah, and the Patriots will never win the championship, but they did

Now, gee I wonder, was Faulk an everyday back in college? Well sure, it aint the pro's, but I do faintly remember Faulk setting a few college rushing records.

FYI......

Faulk is 3rd ALL-TIME in the SEC in rushing attempts per game, behind only Hershel Walker and Emmitt Smith. Hershel averaged 30.1 per game, Smith avg 22.5 per game, and Faulk averaged 20.9 per game.

 

[freak]

Re: you've got it half right peg !!!

I think we'll use next years draft to get Maurice Clarett.

Clarrett is not eligible for next year's draft. He's a true soph, and he will not be 3 years removed from high school.

 

[Steve1]

Freak, you are a wealth of interesting information!

I knew Faulk hadn't fumbled much the last couple of years, but only once? That's pretty good, even with his somewhat limited chances. And the stuff you said about most of Faulk's rushes last year NOT being around end, and how by far most of his touches were NOT on third down-well, that's quite telling. It shows that, maybe, the coaching staff isn't averse to using Faulk more and more. Now, I just want to know, where did you get your info from? Did you chart the plays yourself? Are you BILL BELICHECK? Only kidding, LOL

 

[freak]

I got the situational stats from Yahoo sports.

I've also gone through the play-by-play for each game before, for such informatiion. The problem is that those only categorize runs as right, middle, and left.

I believe Yahoo determines "wide" by outside of the OTs, on plays like tosses or sweeps. As I said, off tackle runs are often misinterpreted as meaning off OT, when it really means off DT. Although they go left/right, it is still a tackle-tackle run.