Patriots have reached agreement with free-agent wide receiver Brandon Lloyd.

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shasta said:
Sorry but that just dosen't get it done. You said that the "CORE" payers on defense were alredy there when B.B. took over the team. They clearly were not, and it was moves by B.B. in both the draft, F.A. and trades that put thoses players in place for not only the Super Bowl wins, but he the entire time he's been here. There's no shame in admitting when your wrong.
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I'm not wrong, or I would say I was wrong...I have a different opinion than yours...IMO The players that were already on the team and the players that were brought in on defense in 2001, after they were gone, BB has had a hard time replacing them....Now I am going by what I have seen since those players left. I am seeing a revolving door at safety, Corner, Dline....it seems every year we are cutting and bringing in a new lineup If you look at the defense from 2001-2006 and count how many different starters and then from 2007-present how many different starters, its pretty obvious, that the pats are having a hard time getting a core built again after the other core left. All my opinion....so now that I know yours, you do not have to make anymore snarky remarks back at me...
 
Oswlek said:
Vrabes, Law, Harrison, Willie, Washington, Bruschi, Poole, Johnson and Phifer were all at least 7 year vets in 2003. It isn't completely out of the question that a few of the current youngsters will be better 3-4 years from now...
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Very possible, I am speaking from the number of players that have been tried at safety, corner and Dline, since the core of the 2003 superbowl defense left, which goes back to my thought that they are having a hard time replacing them.
 
midgar8784 said:
Very possible, I am speaking from the number of players that have been tried at safety, corner and Dline, since the core of the 2003 superbowl defense left, which goes back to my thought that they are having a hard time replacing them.
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Again, past vs. present. When you blow three straight years of drafts (and 4 out of 5 if you go back to 2004) you will have gone through a bunch of bodies. But that only definitively says you had a hard time, not that you are having one.
 
Oswlek said:
Again, past vs. present. When you blow three straight years of drafts (and 4 out of 5 if you go back to 2004) you will have gone through a bunch of bodies. But that only definitively says you had a hard time, not that you are having one.
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Well the only thing that makes me say having one, is I have not seen it fixed yet....even this year there is a huge change over of players....the D line and the secondary will look pretty different this year I think. So its still a work in progress which makes me still say having an issue.
 
midgar8784 said:
Well the only thing that makes me say having one, is I have not seen it fixed yet....even this year there is a huge change over of players....the D line and the secondary will look pretty different this year I think. So its still a work in progress which makes me still say having an issue.
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Of course not. And you won't until it is, but the solution will have been from 3-5 years ago, the same way the problem was as well.

You are commenting about the past. Just understand this and things will make more sense.
 
midgar8784 said:
I'm not wrong, or I would say I was wrong...I have a different opinion than yours...IMO The players that were already on the team and the players that were brought in on defense in 2001, after they were gone, BB has had a hard time replacing them....Now I am going by what I have seen since those players left. I am seeing a revolving door at safety, Corner, Dline....it seems every year we are cutting and bringing in a new lineup If you look at the defense from 2001-2006 and count how many different starters and then from 2007-present how many different starters, its pretty obvious, that the pats are having a hard time getting a core built again after the other core left. All my opinion....so now that I know yours, you do not have to make anymore snarky remarks back at me...
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Originally Posted by midgar8784
Technically the core of the players on Defense were already in place in the years the pats "won" the superbowls BB has not done well replacing them as of yet.

No you are wrong, and changing the argument along the way as you are proven to be wrong doesn't do much for your credibility. The core players were not here when B.B. arrived as you said, he brought them here starting in 2000 and continued to bring them in throughout the time he's been here. Changing your argument mid stream to "oh well he hasn't done a good job of replacing them" doesn't make your original claim less foolish.
 
Good points and perspective, Os. Remember 02 when Willie Mac was such a staple that the Pats left him unprotected in the expansion draft? But who could imagine the 03-04 Pats without big Willie Style?
 
shasta said:
Originally Posted by midgar8784
Technically the core of the players on Defense were already in place in the years the pats "won" the superbowls BB has not done well replacing them as of yet.

No you are wrong, and changing the argument along the way as you are proven to be wrong doesn't do much for your credibility. The core players were not here when B.B. arrived as you said, he brought them here starting in 2000 and continued to bring them in throughout the time he's been here. Changing your argument mid stream to "oh well he hasn't done a good job of replacing them" doesn't make your original claim less foolish.
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Ok, thanks.:rolleyes:
 
HSanders said:
Good points and perspective, Os. Remember 02 when Willie Mac was such a staple that the Pats left him unprotected in the expansion draft? But who could imagine the 03-04 Pats without big Willie Style?
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Yup. He was given the 12th man award in 2003 largely because they expected him to fade into the sunset behind Rosey Colvin, only to see him log full-time minutes.
 
Oswlek said:
Of course not. And you won't until it is, but the solution will have been from 3-5 years ago, the same way the problem was as well.

You are commenting about the past. Just understand this and things will make more sense.
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How can it be from 3-5 years ago, when a lot of players from 3-5 years ago are not even here anymore? I am speaking of the revolving door at safety, corner and Dline...Its as if they are still looking and have been for awhile.
 
midgar8784 said:
How can it be from 3-5 years ago, when a lot of players from 3-5 years ago are not even here anymore? I am speaking of the revolving door at safety, corner and Dline...Its as if they are still looking and have been for awhile.
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That is precisely the problem!
 
Oswlek said:
That is precisely the problem!
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I agree, thats just it...we have no continuity on defense and have not in awhile....I remember going into years saying, ok this player is here this player is here and you just felt set with a few tweaks...now it just feels like every year we are doing overhauls.
 
midgar8784 said:
I agree, thats just it...we have no continuity on defense and have not in awhile....I remember going into years saying, ok this player is here this player is here and you just felt set with a few tweaks...now it just feels like every year we are doing overhauls.
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Just reset your clock to start in 2010 and ignore everything else, and you'll see BB's plan.
 
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