Looking at the Patriots 2023

[king of kings]

The answer is really, last offseason and everything that occurred during the season. I can't remember another comparable year in which just about every single decision failed so completely. Yet the flip side to that is the team could have easily still ended with a winning record and in the playoffs. I tend to think that this year is going to lean towards the extreme one way or the other.

Instead of repeating how much you hate BB & Jones . Who do you get to replace them. Fix those problems with the current cap & draft.

 

[Big/Sky/Fly]

Mac is not worth starter money. I’ve been saying it for years.

If he can prove that he deserves a big contract, then, great! But, he has a mountain of a challenge to prove that though.

 

[Big/Sky/Fly]

About 12 years ago, I had my own business doing loss control for different insurance companies. I was offered an opportunity to do some ergonomic evaluation for a company whose client had one guy with some physical problems starting to bother him.

Lo and behold, the client was the New England Patriots. The guy having a problem was Bill Belichick's Administrative Assistant who sits outside Bill's office and guards the only door. I did the eval and made a shit-ton of recommendations and helped the guy do some re-arrangement of a totally buried office. As I'm wrapping up, this guy said that he heard I was there and asked me to check out his office setup. Up we go from the ground floor to the third floor admin offices. The office was twice the size of a tractor trailer and had three twelve foot tables right down the middle of it. The walls on either side of tables were white boards with two of them having slots. I did the ergonomic review and helped him redesign his desk set up and the four computer monitors to much better position. The he told me that his office was the Draft Room every April and the slotted board were the consensus top 100 players. The other slotted board was the Patriots' scouting and evaluation top 100 players, by position. The guy took me back down to coaches row and I met most of the coaching staff including Bill, Josh and a most of the others. The guy's name that introduced to everyone was Nick Caserio.

Piggy, your dead nuts correct. Bill and his staff know what everyone is thinking but have a totally different pont of view about the way they evaluate and value players. I was privileged to get to walk through a place few are allowed to tread. I was also given the inside view of the way they set up and operate during the draft. It's probably a different room today since the networks get to look in, but I can say, at the time, I, BK got to see the way that the Patriots think.

An insider in this place! Cool!

So, did Nick freak you out with his big eyes?

 

[Hawg73]

Bill often said of Brady that there was no other quarterback he would want on his team other than Brady. That was a pretty strong ringing endorsement. That being said, I agree with you that Bill isn’t the type to throw verbal bouquets nor should he.

This off season is about really seeing what he has in Mac with a legitimate coach like Bill O’Brien running the offense. I agree 1000% about the open competition with Zappe. We have got to find our best quarterback and I think that will happen this off-season.

I am pretty psyched for the draft tomorrow. Almost giddy.

I actually disagree with the bolded or partially do. Bill often pumps up opponents, which he'll do almost every in-season presser, but you can tell when he's just doing it strategically and when he really loves who a player is and what he does. It's almost funny at times, as in how he would praise Ed Reed or Larry Fitz to the rafters. He loves great players and looks for opportunities, for the deserving few (even if sometimes exaggerated) to hear it from a Living Legend. Those guys know his rep as a heartless monster is a media construct and are proud and thrilled that he recognizes them in that way.

He'll also do it for his own guys, but typically give modest praise, at least in public, until they hang it up. Only then will he tell you what he really thought/thinks about one of his players. He's a tough love sort of guy, but all those rings on the fingers of guys who have played here are more important than some of the pep talks that get delivered through the media by other coaches, many of whom don't last long in the League. Very few former players (Assante) rip him despite his crusty persona but he never, but never, publicly throws one of his guys under the bus. He takes all the heat for all of them and I find that a classy thing to do. I absolutely hate hearing other HCs doing that stuff. I know Bill's guys appreciate that. Did he rip Jakoby for the end of the Raiders game? Or Mac? Nope. It was all his fault. If you give yourself to football and do things the right way then he'll be loyal forever even if he doesn't butter people up. If you are into yourself and don't buy into his program then he loses patience and moves on without ever calling you out. When he rips an opponent, which is extremely rare, it is always somebody that mouthed off first or disrespected his players in public. And that is always hilarious because he will hold nothing back. He will rip them to shreds in a casual, matter-of-fact way.

I'm always fascinated by how he does his thing, even if I disagree with what he says or does. He lives by a Football code and expects his people will do the same. Nothing wrong with that.

I doubt he thinks Mac is really a bad kid with an attitude problem, but if anybody thinks he wouldn't give the starting job to Zappe if the kid outplays him in TC, then they haven't been paying attention. No matter what Bob Kraft or anybody else thinks. There are no sacred cows in Foxboro and I love it that way.

 

[rivshark86]

I don’t hate Mac Jones, but I really hope everyone on this board starts to imagine what the pats will look like with the salary cap space of Mac being paid like a “QB1”.

It’s bad enough that it’s worth trading him for something right now.

 

[king of kings]

I actually disagree with the bolded or partially do. Bill often pumps up opponents, which he'll do almost every in-season presser, but you can tell when he's just doing it strategically and when he really loves who a player is and what he does. It's almost funny at times, as in how he would praise Ed Reed or Larry Fitz to the rafters. He loves great players and looks for opportunities, for the deserving few (even if sometimes exaggerated) to hear it from a Living Legend. Those guys know his rep as a heartless monster is a media construct and are proud and thrilled that he recognizes them in that way.

He'll also do it for his own guys, but typically give modest praise, at least in public, until they hang it up. Only then will he tell you what he really thought/thinks about one of his players. He's a tough love sort of guy, but all those rings on the fingers of guys who have played here are more important than some of the pep talks that get delivered through the media by other coaches, many of whom don't last long in the League. Very few former players (Assante) rip him despite his crusty persona but he never, but never, publicly throws one of his guys under the bus. He takes all the heat for all of them and I find that a classy thing to do. I absolutely hate hearing other HCs doing that stuff. I know Bill's guys appreciate that. Did he rip Jakoby for the end of the Raiders game? Or Mac? Nope. It was all his fault. If you give yourself to football and do things the right way then he'll be loyal forever even if he doesn't butter people up. If you are into yourself and don't buy into his program then he loses patience and moves on without ever calling you out. When he rips an opponent, which is extremely rare, it is always somebody that mouthed off first or disrespected his players in public. And that is always hilarious because he will hold nothing back. He will rip them to shreds in a casual, matter-of-fact way.

I'm always fascinated by how he does his thing, even if I disagree with what he says or does. He lives by a Football code and expects his people will do the same. Nothing wrong with that.

I doubt he thinks Mac is really a bad kid with an attitude problem, but if anybody thinks he wouldn't give the starting job to Zappe if the kid outplays him in TC, then they haven't been paying attention. No matter what Bob Kraft or anybody else thinks. There are no sacred cows in Foxboro and I love it that way.

You forgot about BB being pissed about Welker Block. It's one of the rare times . He called out a player in a press conferences.
"It was a deliberate play by the receiver to take out Aqib. No attempt to get open," Belichick said. "I'll let the league handle the discipline on that play, whatever they decide. It's one of the worst plays I've seen. That's all I'll say about that."

 

[Grogan]

Instead of repeating how much you hate BB & Jones . Who do you get to replace them. Fix those problems with the current cap & draft.

Funny, because I said none of that. I actually expect Jones will shock a lot of people this season, but it's clear that your simplistic mind can't hold two different thoughts at the same time. Last season was disaster in every single decision that was made, yet somehow in your mind acknowledging that fact equals hating Bill and Mac.

 

[Hawg73]

You forgot about BB being pissed about Welker Block. It's one of the rare times . He called out a player in a press conferences.
"It was a deliberate play by the receiver to take out Aqib. No attempt to get open," Belichick said. "I'll let the league handle the discipline on that play, whatever they decide. It's one of the worst plays I've seen. That's all I'll say about that."

Good point, King. While Welker was a former Patriot at the time, and a great one, that was an exception to the general "rule".

I forgot about that one, but thanks.

 

[Patriots-Lifer]

Looking ahead to this exact time next year...............................

BB, IF he keeps Mac Jones will have to make a very costly decision. Will he accept Mac's fifth year option? It's going to cost about $38M in 2025.
Prepare yourselves. Mac Jones just might be wearing a new uniform by this time Friday morning.

Both Belichick and O'Brien have been asked about Mac being the starting QB:

BB: "Mac Jones has shown that he can play QB in the NFL."

BOB: "Everyone will get a chance to compete."

Not exactly ringing endorsements of Mac being the starter in 2023.

Your constant posting of the same Dislike of Mac Jones post are starting to wear thin. You have nothing to back up your theories other than you own opinion.

 

[Patriots-Lifer]

Given the fact that Bill treated the GOAT QB the same way he treated everybody else, why would anybody expect he would throw bouquets at Mac? He's
a master motivator and chose those words deliberately.

If Jones Is entitled, which has been suggested by some, and needs to feel love from his HC, then maybe he needs to try his luck somewhere else. I personally
don't believe that is the case and all of this stuff is the media simply finding a way to drive the fanbase crazy.

If we Draft a QB this year, as we often have, then it doesn't mean Mac is out. It just means Bill will do whatever he feels like and if it undermines
somebody's confidence then too bad for them. We don't do Hothouse Flowers.

I'd be very disappointed if Mac and Zappe were NOT in open competition for the job. Let the best player play. No pats on the pooper required.

Some just can not see the facts set before them.

 

[Patriots-Lifer]

I don’t hate Mac Jones, but I really hope everyone on this board starts to imagine what the pats will look like with the salary cap space of Mac being paid like a “QB1”.

It’s bad enough that it’s worth trading him for something right now.

Why is it so hard to believe you?

 

[spacecrime]

We know.

years and years abd years ad nauseum

 

[spacecrime]

Funny, because I said none of that. I actually expect Jones will shock a lot of people this season, but it's clear that your simplistic mind can't hold two different thoughts at the same time. Last season was disaster in every single decision that was made, yet somehow in your mind acknowledging that fact equals hating Bill and Mac.

One wonders how "every single decision" in an entire year can be a disaster. Every personnel decision, every play call, every bit of coaching...how did they ever gain a yard, never mind win a game. Wow.

 

[Grogan]

One wonders how "every single decision" in an entire year can be a disaster. Every personnel decision, every play call, every bit of coaching...how did they ever gain a yard, never mind win a game. Wow.

One wonders how one could evaluate the entirety of last years offseason and come away with any other conclusion than it was an abject failure. Then again, rumpswabs have their place in existence, congratulations you've clearly found yours.

 

[Grogan]

His Reply showed he's not Intrested. In having a Football discussion. It was a simple question.

I don't suffer fools, and only fools would try and argue last offseason as anything other than the failure it was. No rational fan would waste their time arguing otherwise. LOL

 

[BigKen]

I don't suffer fools, and only fools would try and argue last offseason as anything other than the failure it was. No rational fan would waste their time arguing otherwise. LOL

2022 was a disaster that Shakespeare couldn't describe in any way that's palatable. Bill's decision to bring back Patricia and Judge was understandable but putting them in charge of the offense was bizarre, to say the least. As is the Belichick we all know, he does not feel any need to apologize or explain himself. It's on to the next thing and put negatives behind us.

I've argued with posters and live people almost to the point where people have wanted to take a swing at me. "MY OPINION" is that the game has passed Bill Belichick and his methods and style are about 15 years behind. The modern NFL is a league of mobile quarterbacks and high-speed receivers. Bill is still in the 'pocket passer' and 'timing route wide receivers' mode. As such, the Patriots pose no threat to teams that are now speeding up their defenses because their offenses are top 10. Here's the problem. Bill is 71 years old. He can't change. I'm two years older than Bill and I saw the changes coming when RGIII was drafted. He didn't last, but the next level came and we started seeing QBs with cannon arms and legs that could move.

The players today are not complacent, accepting people like they were in 1995 or even 2005. These guys were raised playing Madden and have a much deeper understanding of the new game of lightning reaction and millisecond response. Bill is playing Atari while the rest of the league is moving toward PS5.

 

[sg14]

I forget where I heard this, but the Patricia to Philly move "was a favor to Robert Kraft by the Eagles ownership".

 

[DarnSyd]

Funny, because I said none of that. I actually expect Jones will shock a lot of people this season, but it's clear that your simplistic mind can't hold two different thoughts at the same time. Last season was disaster in every single decision that was made, yet somehow in your mind acknowledging that fact equals hating Bill and Mac.

Jesus, hyperbole much? Bill blundered replacing the exodus of offensive coaches, but despite having a relatively tough schedule the Patriots finished 15th in DVOA, had the 10th highest point differential, had relatively bad luck in a few close games, had the 3rd ranked defense (DVOA), and had what appears to be a decent draft.

It was a disappointing season but there were positives to build on for 2023.

 

[Muse]

Well today's gonna be a good day with the draft and people here. ,































Oh, vey

 

[Hawg73]

I forget where I heard this, but the Patricia to Philly move "was a favor to Robert Kraft by the Eagles ownership".

In that case, well done Jeff Lurie.

I don't doubt Patricia has some sort of acumen that pertains to football, but I've been unable to determine what exactly that is over years of
watching and wondering. One thing I know is NOT counted in his skillset is getting his calls communicated in a timely basis. Before he left
for Detroit his D's seemed to have multiple guys waving at each other madly right up until the ball was snapped as everyone tried to figure
out how to apply the call to the formation. The next year, Brian Flores installed his own method and all that stuff stopped instantly and the
D got better. Then, he takes over the Offense last year and the calls would again come in late and nobody understood what they were supposed
to be doing.

Coincidence? I think not.

The most important move of the offseason was to pull the plug on the Matt Patricia experiment and replace him with BoB. Bar none.