Flores suing the Giants - Dramatic revelations

[Mazz22]

I think the NFL is doing a lot of backpedaling from their initial dismissiveness of the lawsuit, which indicates they're likely looking for a way to expedite a resolution to the case (i.e. they will attempt to reach a settlement with Flores as soon as possible). The NFL will want to avoid a likely embarrassing discovery phase. This would include Belichick answering questions under oath about the text exchange with Flores and whatever conversations he may have had with Buffalo and NYG. Other texts and emails from Belichick and many others may come to light as well, which is guaranteed to be messy. So again, it's in the NFL's best interest to settle the lawsuit if possible. Also, Flores if hired as a HC in the interim would lose momentum with his case. He doesn't seem likely to get a HC job at the moment.

I don't think Flores will turn into the Colin Kaepernick of NFL head coaches. Given the state of the roster, I think he did a decent job with Miami. As a first time HC he had basically the same record as Belichick over the last two seasons. Given the allegations against him in the lawsuit, Stephen Ross looks REALLY bad and I think it's probable he fired Flores because Flores wasn't willing to go along with Ross' disreputable suggestions.

I think Flores deserves another shot as a HC in the NFL for an owner who isn't bribing him to lose and firing him for winning.

Ok. But Flores did not start this firestorm because he wants to be a HC. He started it because he believes there is systemic racism in the NFL. There is no doubt that the latter is true but how to solve it or make for a more equitable for everyone is the main issue. As you say, the NFL is going to squash this at every turn. This is why I keep saying Flores is being ill-advised with this approach. This is NOT how change happens at any level when dealing with an issue this enormous. What is even sadder is he has torpedoed his career.

 

[HSanders]

i'd like to see absolute PROOF that there is "systemic racism" in coaching hires. and by that i don't mean the laughable use of % of population. that is proof of nothing.

 

[Big/Sky/Fly]

I think Flores deserves another shot as a HC in the NFL for an owner who isn't bribing him to lose and firing him for winning.

I agree with you on this, but, he did himself no favors.

 

[Mazz22]

I can't believe folks are surprised by tanking. It happens every year.

 

[crawhammer]

Ok. But Flores did not start this firestorm because he wants to be a HC. He started it because he believes there is systemic racism in the NFL. There is no doubt that the latter is true but how to solve it or make for a more equitable for everyone is the main issue. As you say, the NFL is going to squash this at every turn. This is why I keep saying Flores is being ill-advised with this approach. This is NOT how change happens at any level when dealing with an issue this enormous. What is even sadder is he has torpedoed his career.

I don't think it's fair to say HE torpedoed his HC career. If the allegations against Ross are true then Flores literally was setup to fail. Even still, under the circumstances Flores achieved reasonable success with the Dolphins. He was basically railroaded into unemployment by his boss. Seemingly Flores thinks Ross and subsequently the NFL's unfair hiring practices torpedoed his career so he's fighting back with the lawsuit.

I can't believe folks are surprised by tanking. It happens every year.

Perhaps informally. You don't find it alarming that an owner is allegedly offering his HC $100,000 to lose games?

i'd like to see absolute PROOF that there is "systemic racism" in coaching hires. and by that i don't mean the laughable use of % of population. that is proof of nothing.

You don't find it suspicious that there's only 1 black HC in the NFL currently?

I think the point of the lawsuit is to try and establish proof (if it ever gets to trial). This lawsuit is unprecedented, so if you're looking for established legal proof then you won't find it. But that's different from it actually being a real thing.

 

[Big/Sky/Fly]

I don't think it's fair to say HE torpedoed his HC career. If the allegations against Ross are true then Flores literally was setup to fail. Even still, under the circumstances Flores achieved reasonable success with the Dolphins. He was basically railroaded into unemployment by his boss. Seemingly Flores thinks Ross and subsequently the NFL's unfair hiring practices torpedoed his career so he's fighting back with the lawsuit.


Perhaps informally. You don't find it alarming that an owner is allegedly offering his HC $100,000 to lose games?


You don't find it suspicious that there's only 1 black HC in the NFL currently?

I think the point of the lawsuit is to try and establish proof (if it ever gets to trial). This lawsuit is unprecedented, so if you're looking for established legal proof then you won't find it. But that's different from it actually being a real thing.

Why should there be more black head coaches? Explain your reasons.

 

[crawhammer]

Why should there be more black head coaches? Explain your reasons.

Maybe there shouldn't but that's not the point. Are black candidates subjected to an unfair and unequal hiring process? If so then that's your answer.

Given fairness and equality, every candidate for HC should be evaluated on their personal merit and experience. I find it hard to believe that there aren't more black candidates with the requisite skills and experience to be a head coach in the NFL.

 

[Big/Sky/Fly]

Maybe there shouldn't but that's not the point. Are black candidates subjected to an unfair and unequal hiring process? If so then that's your answer.

Given fairness and equality, every candidate for HC should be evaluated on their personal merit and experience. I find it hard to believe that there aren't more black candidates with the requisite skills and experience to be a head coach in the NFL.

If they deserve to be a head coach, then they deserve it. That's my opinion. Flores did a good enough job IMO. Skin color shouldn't have any bearing on it.

Ross sounds like he prefers ass kissers and yes men. Ross should try being the head coach. That would be interesting.

 

[HSanders]

i agree that all candidates deserve fair and equal treatment.
i'd like to see any kind of factual information that show x # of black candidates with x qualifications tried to get interviews and couldn't while the same # of whites with similar qualifications got interviews/hires, stuff like that. i still think the issue has other nuances.

 

[Mazz22]

If they deserve to be a head coach, then they deserve it. That's my opinion. Flores did a good enough job IMO. Skin color shouldn't have any bearing on it.

Ross sounds like he prefers ass kissers and yes men. Ross should try being the head coach. That would be interesting.

3 years no playoffs. Pretty much every coach gets fired for that type of record.

I think most owners are more like Ross than not. These are billionaires most of whom were born on third base.

Flores naivety surprises me the most.

 

[crawhammer]

3 years no playoffs. Pretty much every coach gets fired for that type of record.

Are you talking about Flores?

He won 10 games with Fitzpatrick and Tua in '20. He dragged his team from the swamp this season with a 8-1 finish with Tua and Brissett at quarterback. He had a 4-2 record head-to-head against Belichick and for that alone they should have retained him as the HC.

 

[Mazz22]

Are you talking about Flores?

He won 10 games with Fitzpatrick and Tua in '20. He dragged his team from the swamp this season with a 8-1 finish with Tua and Brissett at quarterback. He had a 4-2 record head-to-head against Belichick and for that alone they should have retained him as the HC.

He was 24-25.
Adam Gase was 23-25 after 3 seasons in Miami and was also fired.

Beating Bill after Brady left with the corpse of Cam Newton and a rookie QB is hardly that impressive.

 

[crawhammer]

Beating Bill after Brady left with the corpse of Cam Newton and a rookie QB is hardly that impressive.

But Bill's a genius. Who needs a quarterback worth a damn!

 

[crawhammer]

 

[aloyouis]

If you honestly think that then we're irretrievably apart. Just read the two or three preceding posts as examples.

Yes, but isn't just me, it is the vast majority of us here. I just happen to be as likely to call out your BS as you are to spew it.

He texted the wrong Brian, pretty much everyone has drawn that conclusion. And it's extremely unlikely that he misread a text. When he thought he was talking to Daboll he said he heard from Buffalo and NYG that (Daboll) was their guy. Daboll being Buffalo's OC, obviously Buffalo is talking about Daboll. If that's not good enough for you then you'd have to believe Belichick misread two separate texts from two different teams. And misread them in the same manner. It's just not plausible.

OK. Then he texted the wrong Brian. You still jump to calling him a liar and you can't make it even seem plausible never mind prove it you keep saying it.

They allegedly told the HC of another NFL team that someone other than Flores was getting the job (before the interview). Never mind respect, had they just spit in his face as opposed to bringing him for that sham interview, it would have been a more dignified way to get rid of him.

And that. has NOTHING TO DO with Belichick. In the time frame of this discussion I have become aware of both a hiring and a firing. It happens all the time.

Someone tell the NFL owners.

Watch the draft.

 

[foobahl]

I think the NFL is doing a lot of backpedaling from their initial dismissiveness of the lawsuit, which indicates they're likely looking for a way to expedite a resolution to the case (i.e. they will attempt to reach a settlement with Flores as soon as possible). The NFL will want to avoid a likely embarrassing discovery phase. This would include Belichick answering questions under oath about the text exchange with Flores and whatever conversations he may have had with Buffalo and NYG. Other texts and emails from Belichick and many others may come to light as well, which is guaranteed to be messy. So again, it's in the NFL's best interest to settle the lawsuit if possible. Also, Flores if hired as a HC in the interim would lose momentum with his case. He doesn't seem likely to get a HC job at the moment.

I don't think Flores will turn into the Colin Kaepernick of NFL head coaches. Given the state of the roster, I think he did a decent job with Miami. As a first time HC he had basically the same record as Belichick over the last two seasons. Given the allegations against him in the lawsuit, Stephen Ross looks REALLY bad and I think it's probable he fired Flores because Flores wasn't willing to go along with Ross' disreputable suggestions.

I think Flores deserves another shot as a HC in the NFL for an owner who isn't bribing him to lose and firing him for winning.

My belief is that neither Flores nor the NFL want BB answering questions under oath. I do not believe for one second that BB will shade the truth in any way under oath.

 

[Phil Elliott]

My belief is that neither Flores nor the NFL want BB answering questions under oath. I do not believe for one second that BB will shade the truth in any way under oath.

For crissakes, he's accused of being too candid when he's NOT under oath...now, we think he's going to fudge things UNDER OATH?. Jesus H Christ...

 

[aloyouis]

My belief is that neither Flores nor the NFL want BB answering questions under oath. I do not believe for one second that BB will shade the truth in any way under oath.

For crissakes, he's accused of being too candid when he's NOT under oath...now, we think he's going to fudge things UNDER OATH?. Jesus H Christ...

Same thing, no?

 

[crawhammer]

Yes, but isn't just me, it is the vast majority of us here. I just happen to be as likely to call out your BS as you are to spew it.

Being "anti-Bill" makes me immediately unpopular. By virtue of this being a Patriots forum, there are many opportunities for me to be positioned against the grain because the general flavor here is Belichick got it right or he's getting it right. I see a lot of holes in that way of thinking and Belichick's got the track record to prove me right. In other words, I don't consider myself spewing BS.

However, nothing I say should be taken as me being stubborn enough to think Belichick isn't the most accomplished HC in the history of the NFL.

Where I differ with most here is how he got there. And I'm not talking about cheating because that's bullshit. I'm talking about the QB.

OK. Then he texted the wrong Brian. You still jump to calling him a liar and you can't make it even seem plausible never mind prove it you keep saying it.

He literally typed the words "I misread the text. I think they are naming Daboll." If Belichick thought he was talking to Daboll up to that point in the conversation (which everyone agrees) then he wouldn't have misread the earlier text to say Daboll. It would have been exactly the opposite scenario.

He even says "I fucked this up" about how he had read the text. If he's talking to Flores and he says I misread the text then he misread it to say Daboll. If he's talking to Daboll and he says I misread the the text then he misread it to say Flores. The problem is he thought he was talking to Daboll when he in fact was talking to Flores. Realizing his mistake he tried to pass it off like he knew he was talking to Flores the whole time, which has more holes than Clyde Barrow.

Watch the draft.

For Head Coaches?

 

[Phil Elliott]

Same thing, no?

Yes. I was agreeing.