king of kings
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Yep Moore , Arrington & Edelman were are CBs. Enough said . It was so bad slater started at FS that season.
Brady not going to settle
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Yep Moore , Arrington & Edelman were are CBs. Enough said . It was so bad slater started at FS that season.
Patriots71
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Teams are out for themselves. They would let the Patriots burn to the ground and not even look back at the smoke.
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This is more attempted PR spin coming from the league. They know they're toast.
I don't think Brady accepts a fine. A fine for what, exactly, for the league making shit up? For Bob Kraft being a pussy?
I think the NFLPA would be just fine taking this to court over a fine, and Brady still hasn't (and won't) pay a dime (other than union dues) for his legal representation.
All this "negotiation" talk over the last few days, you can TELL it's all being leaked from the league. I still maintain the NFLPA hasn't said jack shit to anyone since they declared they'll go to court unless the punishment is vacated.
Number Cruncher
Time to go.... NOW
So what is the downside to the NFLPA saying, "The reports of settlement negotiations are false. We made our appeal and are awaiting the ruling of the Commissioner before deciding which Federal Court to take this to".
Okay, so that last part is tongue in cheek, but what is the downside to saying they are not in settlement talks? Unless they are :shrug: ? They certainly can't be afraid of the league getting caught in yet another lie.
The NFLPA has been on-****ing-point this entire time.
Why say anything? Why get in a war of words with the league? The NFLPA doesn't have two cable networks to report everything they say as absolute fact. Let the league do what it's going to do, and stay out of it. There's nothing the NFLPA can say or do that will actually help anything at this point.
The point is, even if the NFLPA is in negotiation with the NFL, which I don't truly believe they are, due to the way the appeal went down (if you remember back, the NFLPA went on offense and asked Goodell to recuse himself as arbitrator, and also said that they formally requested as much, and the NFL came back with a massive response, including a statement from Goodell himself saying "No, **** off" essentially. This was the whole, "This is Troy Vincent's punishment, this is my punishment, this is Troy Vincent's punishment" thing.), the last thing they're going to do is go to the media with it, because it would really weaken their position.
This is now, what, the fourth different report of "negotiations" in the last 3 days or so, and they all say the exact same thing, with the only variation being what the league's "position" is.
It's nothing more than Goodell and his legal team sticking his finger in the air to determine which way public opinion is blowing.
This is also why, while I'm gratified that the media appears to be coming around a bit, I almost wish that there were more blowback demanding the suspension stay in place.
One more thing, Goodell's got two options. Keep the suspension in place, or vacate it completely. Any reduction makes Brady's case in court all that much stronger, and you have to believe the NFL knows that by now. At least, you'd hope so.
Number Cruncher
Time to go.... NOW
I hear you, but I would say it this way...
If I am the NFLPA, I am thinking big picture long term here. This is bigger than the Brady Case to them. They want to eff the league hard, to change the way things are done, and to have a better position next time collective bargaining rolls around. They too, will be around long after Tom hangs them up and they have so many other players and fights to be fought down the line. What better way than to weaken the league with another head-handing to them from a Federal Judge. If I am the NFLPA I want GoodHELL to keep it at four, force us into court and further embarrass the league.
A statement refuting that settlement talks are underway, especially if it is true, is another way to poke the Commissioner in an effort to get him to do what they want.. keep it at four. You said yourself that GoodHELL has two options, 4 or 0, and anything they can do, calling those reports false (and subtly saying the league is lying) might help push GoodHELL right where they want him to go. Refuting is a WIN WIN for the NFLPA.
Unless of course, there are talks going on... then silence is the better option.
Maxjax
Well-known member
My apologies if this has been posted already but saw this over the weekend and had to share. Great piece.
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/roger-goodell-s-handling-of-deflate-gate-has-become-three-ring-circus-063247603.html
One month and Goodell still can't figure out what to do, which somehow isn't really all that surprising since if he knew what to do in the first place the entire story would have been snuffed out in a day or so – or however long it took the NFL to figure out it has no idea, let alone any actual proof, that the footballs at the AFC title game were even all that deflated.
The Washington Post is reporting some owners are trying to figure out how the NFL commissioner can come out of this appearing "credible and looking like he's dealing from a position of strength." They might try encouraging him to just rule on the evidence rather than go with that pipe dream, but whatever.
Meanwhile, ProFootballTalk reports that a "small group of influential owners" are pushing Goodell to uphold the suspension, so it's nice to see some lobbying of the commissioner by rival teams who didn't participate in the disciplinary process.
It's not a coincidence that Brady and the NFL Players Association are left to do their own saber rattling in the media, claiming they'll sue everyone and everything if the New England Patriots quarterback isn't exonerated.
There are three rings to this circus.
It's fairly easy to envision Goodell locked in his office trying to figure out how to get out of a mess in which he put himself, the league and Brady. One month later and he apparently hasn't figured it out … or had anyone figure it for him.
This is truly one of the dumbest scandals in sports history, a molehill the NFL turned into a mountain.
It bears repeating there remains no proof the footballs were even significantly deflated in deflate-gate. For all the curiousness and suspicion from having some Foxborough locker room lackey calling himself "The Deflator" and taking the balls into a bathroom just before kickoff, he may not have even deflated anything.
That should have been obvious to the NFL within a day of the AFC championship game. You'd think the league would have started there.
At halftime of that game, referee Walt Anderson had taken some convoluted measurements that came in with a wide range of data, many of them not particularly out of the norm. That's in part because of natural gas law, in part because this could in no way be considered any place for accurate scientific work and in part because Anderson used separate, and wildly different, gauges to take the data.
At that point the NFL should have realized that this case was a loser. Suspicious district attorneys have to do this all the time and just refuse to prosecute. Even if the league thought the Pats were up to something, generally you have to have some kind of decent evidence.
Besides, the NFL had never in its history cared about the inflation level of footballs, even in a league that loves creating rules for all known circumstances. It has no idea how footballs are naturally affected by various weather elements or contact. It never dawned on the league to care until an untimely episode occurred right before the Super Bowl.
A good commissioner, or a good leader of any organization, would have bailed, squashed, protected and vowed to solve the problem going forward. No way this is a scandal in the NBA or even in the old NFL.
Fine the Pats for lack of proper pregame protocol because a guy took the footballs into the bathroom. Then call it case closed.
Instead after a little more than a day of collecting basic evidence and interviews, ESPN coincidentally (or not) ran with a bombshell report that 11 of the 12 Patriots footballs were underinflated by more than two pounds per square inch and, conversely, none of the Indianapolis Colts' measured as such.
It was damning.
It was also completely false.
None of the Patriots footballs were so deflated and only four Colts footballs were even measured, so that didn't matter. Someone at Goodell's office may or may not have leaked it – the league office appears to be the only entity at the time with the info. Even if it didn't, the league, equipped with the truth, failed to either refute it or just pass the info onto the Patriots. The league even fed the Pats similarly frightening, and inaccurate, data.
Essentially, whoever leaked it to ESPN counted on the report being so big that the public would believe it no matter what came out later.
It worked.
ESPN has never retracted it even though the actual stats show it breathlessly ran with bad info. The NFL has declined comment on it. Ted Wells didn't investigate how such a media leak could occur, even though he printed the ball measurements that proved it a lie.
Heck, Wells even decided to not take Anderson's word for which gauge he used on which measurements and instead just decided the ref misremembered.
The Wells Report, the independent investigation commissioned by the league, is long though, 243 pages. And it's repetitive, the lawyers just repeating the same stuff over and over like a desperate high school kid trying to pump up a term paper to the proper length.
It takes a while to read and you really have to concentrate and you actually have to go through it a couple times because it's poorly written. This seems intentional.
While plenty of people believe the Patriots and Brady cheated, there are far fewer who have read and studied the Wells Report with an open mind who believe it to be anything but a pile of junk.
You can even believe Brady did it, or at least this was extremely suspicious – as I tend to do – and be appalled at a league office that is willing to suspend him for four games with not just little to no evidence that he did anything but little to no evidence that anything even happened.
It's like an endless hall of mirrors that keeps going and going.
Now the owners are scrambling to find a way to make Roger Goodell's office look competent? And other owners are pressuring for him to stick it to the Patriots, likely well aware that bailing on this case now will only cause further embarrassment?
It's been six months since Walt Anderson couldn't figure out if the balls were all that deflated. It's been one month since Brady spent 10 hours arguing his appeal. It's less than a week to the start of training camp.
Roger Goodell is in his office, still not ready to say what he's going to do.
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/roger-goodell-s-handling-of-deflate-gate-has-become-three-ring-circus-063247603.html
One month and Goodell still can't figure out what to do, which somehow isn't really all that surprising since if he knew what to do in the first place the entire story would have been snuffed out in a day or so – or however long it took the NFL to figure out it has no idea, let alone any actual proof, that the footballs at the AFC title game were even all that deflated.
The Washington Post is reporting some owners are trying to figure out how the NFL commissioner can come out of this appearing "credible and looking like he's dealing from a position of strength." They might try encouraging him to just rule on the evidence rather than go with that pipe dream, but whatever.
Meanwhile, ProFootballTalk reports that a "small group of influential owners" are pushing Goodell to uphold the suspension, so it's nice to see some lobbying of the commissioner by rival teams who didn't participate in the disciplinary process.
It's not a coincidence that Brady and the NFL Players Association are left to do their own saber rattling in the media, claiming they'll sue everyone and everything if the New England Patriots quarterback isn't exonerated.
There are three rings to this circus.
It's fairly easy to envision Goodell locked in his office trying to figure out how to get out of a mess in which he put himself, the league and Brady. One month later and he apparently hasn't figured it out … or had anyone figure it for him.
This is truly one of the dumbest scandals in sports history, a molehill the NFL turned into a mountain.
It bears repeating there remains no proof the footballs were even significantly deflated in deflate-gate. For all the curiousness and suspicion from having some Foxborough locker room lackey calling himself "The Deflator" and taking the balls into a bathroom just before kickoff, he may not have even deflated anything.
That should have been obvious to the NFL within a day of the AFC championship game. You'd think the league would have started there.
At halftime of that game, referee Walt Anderson had taken some convoluted measurements that came in with a wide range of data, many of them not particularly out of the norm. That's in part because of natural gas law, in part because this could in no way be considered any place for accurate scientific work and in part because Anderson used separate, and wildly different, gauges to take the data.
At that point the NFL should have realized that this case was a loser. Suspicious district attorneys have to do this all the time and just refuse to prosecute. Even if the league thought the Pats were up to something, generally you have to have some kind of decent evidence.
Besides, the NFL had never in its history cared about the inflation level of footballs, even in a league that loves creating rules for all known circumstances. It has no idea how footballs are naturally affected by various weather elements or contact. It never dawned on the league to care until an untimely episode occurred right before the Super Bowl.
A good commissioner, or a good leader of any organization, would have bailed, squashed, protected and vowed to solve the problem going forward. No way this is a scandal in the NBA or even in the old NFL.
Fine the Pats for lack of proper pregame protocol because a guy took the footballs into the bathroom. Then call it case closed.
Instead after a little more than a day of collecting basic evidence and interviews, ESPN coincidentally (or not) ran with a bombshell report that 11 of the 12 Patriots footballs were underinflated by more than two pounds per square inch and, conversely, none of the Indianapolis Colts' measured as such.
It was damning.
It was also completely false.
None of the Patriots footballs were so deflated and only four Colts footballs were even measured, so that didn't matter. Someone at Goodell's office may or may not have leaked it – the league office appears to be the only entity at the time with the info. Even if it didn't, the league, equipped with the truth, failed to either refute it or just pass the info onto the Patriots. The league even fed the Pats similarly frightening, and inaccurate, data.
Essentially, whoever leaked it to ESPN counted on the report being so big that the public would believe it no matter what came out later.
It worked.
ESPN has never retracted it even though the actual stats show it breathlessly ran with bad info. The NFL has declined comment on it. Ted Wells didn't investigate how such a media leak could occur, even though he printed the ball measurements that proved it a lie.
Heck, Wells even decided to not take Anderson's word for which gauge he used on which measurements and instead just decided the ref misremembered.
The Wells Report, the independent investigation commissioned by the league, is long though, 243 pages. And it's repetitive, the lawyers just repeating the same stuff over and over like a desperate high school kid trying to pump up a term paper to the proper length.
It takes a while to read and you really have to concentrate and you actually have to go through it a couple times because it's poorly written. This seems intentional.
While plenty of people believe the Patriots and Brady cheated, there are far fewer who have read and studied the Wells Report with an open mind who believe it to be anything but a pile of junk.
You can even believe Brady did it, or at least this was extremely suspicious – as I tend to do – and be appalled at a league office that is willing to suspend him for four games with not just little to no evidence that he did anything but little to no evidence that anything even happened.
It's like an endless hall of mirrors that keeps going and going.
Now the owners are scrambling to find a way to make Roger Goodell's office look competent? And other owners are pressuring for him to stick it to the Patriots, likely well aware that bailing on this case now will only cause further embarrassment?
It's been six months since Walt Anderson couldn't figure out if the balls were all that deflated. It's been one month since Brady spent 10 hours arguing his appeal. It's less than a week to the start of training camp.
Roger Goodell is in his office, still not ready to say what he's going to do.
I have no doubt there are talks going on. I simply doubt it's the NFLPA on its knees begging the NFL to show mercy.
If anything, I assume the opposite.
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This. I can imagine the league countering the no suspension plus exoneration position with a one or two games with just a hint it was mostly non-cooperation but without a full and clear exoneration or admission of nefariousness.
Cheers
Annihilus
Zen Powered by Death Buddhists
To which I am hoping TFB will give them all the righteous middle finger. I'm sure he will, but have been pretty surprised at what has come before now, too...so I'm not counting anything out.
I'm sure BB is telling TOM to crush the front office. I bet Bill would love nothing more than to see these assholes behind all of this get embarrassed...
And I also bet Bendover Bobby has been telling him to settle. You know. For the good of the league.
If he does try to tell TOm to settle that could fracture their relationship. When you tell someone that defending their integrity is less important than the people who are screwing you is a recipe for relationship banana split...And I also bet Bendover Bobby has been telling him to settle. You know. For the good of the league.
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Love your use of language but I'd just like to point out that a banana split is an awesome thing.
Cheers, BostonTim
You're acting like this hasn't happened already.
Brady's a pro, he'd never admit something like that happened to a reporter.
Im guessing BK told TFB to do what he wants, and that its his integrity, and legacy to protect. I also think BK told TFB that his hands are tied because of the league bylaws... Do you think BK would have bent over if he had some real options? Supporting TFB doesn't mean you have to go AL Davis rogue...:shrug:
DeflatedFan
Active member
I keep hearing this talk about "going Al Davis" or "ending up like Al Davis".
I gotta ask...
What the hell did the other owners ever do to get back at Al Davis? Last I saw he died, still in control of the team, and his son is now in control of the team. His team was competitive for many years, won the superbowl, and was in the super bowl only 13 years ago.
Doesn't seem like he suffered too many consequences to me.
If my team's, coaches', players', and even my personal integrity was being railroaded into the dirt, I'll take "Al Davis" over "dirty cheaters with no 1st or 4th round picks and no GOAT for 4 games" every time.