PumpDee
They Hate Us Cuz They Ain't Us.
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We're on to Bailey Zappe.
We're on to Bailey Zappe.
If mac played would it be to try and salvage some trade value?
Earlier in the season, you blamed Patricia for Mac stinking out the joint this year, (even though Patricia was gone). Now I guess you're blaming BB.100% disagree. How you can ignore the fact that BB has done a horrendous job on the offensive side is weird to me.
Earlier in the season, you blamed Patricia for Mac stinking out the joint this year, (even though Patricia was gone). Now I guess you're blaming BB.
Personally, I do blame BB for not having viable backups on the o-line. I also didn't like him signing JuJu to the contract he did, when the guy was coming off an injury. I also think he should have gotten a veteran backup QB, in case Mac played as bad this year as he did last year, (of course I didn't foresee that he'd suck even worse this year). I also think he was too patient with Mac Jones, and should have gone to to Zappe sooner. At the end of the day though, the biggest problem was our lousy starting QB, Mac Jones. While Zappe isn't great by any means (at least not as of yet), he does meet the very low bar of playing better than Mac.
Earlier in the season, you blamed Patricia for Mac stinking out the joint this year, (even though Patricia was gone). Yes. He screwed with him for an entire season. You know, 2022.
Now I guess you're blaming BB. As it turns out, BB hired and placed Patricia in that job. You know, BB? The GENERAL MANAGER?
Personally, I do blame BB for not having viable backups on the o-line. As you should. JuJU too. Nice.
At the end of the day though, the biggest problem was our lousy starting QB, Mac Jones. Can I re-introduce you to 2021?
Apparently, he showed you that. For me, the "regression" started at the end of his first season. What it showed me was that defenses had figured him out, and it was to be determined if he could step it up and cope with what defenses were doing. The answer thus far, is no.BB has had total control of all things patriots for two decades. The fact that the offense completely fell apart after Josh left and was replaced by Bill's handpick successor speaks volumes. Trying to blame all of this on a 23-year-old kid, especially after he showed you, he was more than capable of that in 2021, is weird.
Agree on that end of first season regressionApparently, he showed you that. For me, the "regression" started at the end of his first season. What it showed me was that defenses had figured him out, and it was to be determined if he could step it up and cope with what defenses were doing. The answer thus far, is no.
It was a classic rookie year. Rookies always do relatively well coming into the NFL. The coaches have the training wheels on and run simple plays, which is OK as defenses know nothing about rookies, so it usually works, for a time...... But there is nothing learns faster in life than an NFL coach so eventually defenses get up to speed and that's why you see rookie QBs really struggle in year 2 as the defenses have really studied him and know him and develop the schemes to attack them.Apparently, he showed you that. For me, the "regression" started at the end of his first season. What it showed me was that defenses had figured him out, and it was to be determined if he could step it up and cope with what defenses were doing. The answer thus far, is no.
Definitely. There are indeed fans of the NFL not a specific team. I like a few NFL teams but my favorite (home) team has been the Pats since 1960 (Im an old fart). Before that it was the Giants.I've been posting on Patriots forums since 2007. I'm a fan, not a homer. One is not required to be a homer in order to post about one's team(s).
1. It's beyond a stretch to attribute a change in fortunes of to only one of many possibilities.I really would love to get Bill alone in a room and ask him what went so wrong with BoB as OC. To me that is the biggest disappointment of this season. How did our offense perform worse than last year under Patricia?
Remember Patrick Ramsey? IIRC, he was the high potential QB the Redskins picked in our trade #32 for #21 picks when we got Daniel Graham? Spurrier totally destroyed the guy in less than one season.He was David Carr'd. Acting as if that's on him is just denying reality.
I think we all know that offense was the biggest issue this season. The defense played at a level plenty good enough for this team to contend in the postseason. That falls on Bill O’Brien, and what happened on that side of the ball especially with Mac Jones.1. It's beyond a stretch to attribute a change in fortunes of to only one of many possibilities.
2. Every season is different.
3. Luck (any given Sunday) is huge. Luck should average out over a season, but it doesn't always. We were unbelievably favored by luck in 2001, and it IS possible to toss a coin 17 times and have 13 tosses come up tails.
Both Carr and Ramsey are good comparisons. I just hope Bill didn’t completely kill Mac.Remember Patrick Ramsey? IIRC, he was the high potential QB the Redskins picked in our trade #32 for #21 picks when we got Daniel Graham? Spurrier totally destroyed the guy in less than one season.
Both Carr and Ramsey are good comparisons. I just hope Bill didn’t completely kill Mac.
Who knows.
I feel blaming Bill for Mac's inability to deal with adversity is a bit of a cop out.
Mac deserves a lot of the blame for folding like a cheap plastic chair the second things got tough.
A less talented player than him showed way more resolve despite being very limited. Why didn't Bill "ruin" him?
Look at Justin Fields—dude had zero help for years yet he still played his ass off. Can't say the same about Mac.
I think it was a combo. For sure Bill ruined him IMO but I also think Jones probably does not have the goods either. I am not sure how you can look back on the 2022 season and not come away with Bill severely hurting Jones. He was coming off a very solid rookie year and Bill decides to change the offensive system and hire a DC in Patricia to coach offense. Made no sense especially when the season started going south and Bill did nothing. Then this year, Bill spent the majority of his team building capital on defense leaving the offense in shambles on the Oline and bereft of any real talent at the skill positions despite having cap money to spend.It's difficult to look back at the Mac Jones era and feel that Bill (or the Patriots as an organization) ruined Mac Jones. You could easily ask, "Well, what about Matt Cassel?" (who the Patriots turned into a multi-millionaire). By contrast, I do feel Washington ruined RGIII's career, as did Indy with Andrew Luck, so it does happen.
Mac Jones has a lot of characteristics that I loathe in virtually all highly-touted QB's coming out of college. So many of these guys have been handed the keys to the proverbial Ferrari as children. They've been propped up in their lives for at least the last decade, have faced very little TRUE adversity and when they face it at the pro-level, they are deer in the headlights.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the fathe." - Mike Tyson
These guys get punched in the face and not even their entourage can pick them up off the ground again. A guy like Tom Brady came in knowing he was going to have to take a few punches along the way.
Think back to the mid-90's. How many "can't miss" QB's can you think of coming out of the draft? I am not talking about guys who ended up having great careers, I'm talking about the guys who we had no doubts on coming out of the draft. To me, there are three:
Peyton Manning
Andrew Luck
Joe Burrow
Who else did you feel that way about, if any? You could make a case for Michael Vick, Stafford, Matt Ryan, Cam Newton, etc. The most recent guy I felt that way about was Trevor Lawrence but he's looking more Alex Smith/Carson Palmer-ish each year. Most pressure-packed position in all of sports. Not everybody's built for the challenge. In fact, most aren't.
Asking for a friend. If mac doesn't have the goods, just what was it that Bill ruined? (My friend says he's confused.)I think it was a combo. For sure Bill ruined him IMO but I also think Jones probably does not have the goods either. I am not sure how you can look back on the 2022 season and not come away with Bill severely hurting Jones. He was coming off a very solid rookie year and Bill decides to change the offensive system and hire a DC in Patricia to coach offense. Made no sense especially when the season started going south and Bill did nothing. Then this year, Bill spent the majority of his team building capital on defense leaving the offense in shambles on the Oline and bereft of any real talent at the skill positions despite having cap money to spend.
I brought this up on another thread but you can't dismiss Cassell learning from Brady for 3 years or the fact that he literally inherited a stacked team in 2008 facing one of the easiest schedules on top. He also had a legit OC in McDaniels. I could go on but really IMO it is apples to oranges in comparison ...
Perhaps Bill cut the tags of Mac Jones, thus voiding his warranty?Asking for a friend. If mac doesn't have the goods, just what was it that Bill ruined? (My friend says he's confused.)