Week 7, 49ers at Patriots

[Roberto71]

Glad I didnt post this. But I feel the same way. Said it from the moment this went down. I thought he was a bad fit. Putting an oft injured QB with accuracy issues and mood swings with a bunch of guys that cannot get open does not work well. Yeah his running works well, but in this league you have to be able to pass to win, because defenses will expose you at some point.

He's only been a "bad fit" post-Covid with his play. He has been a very good fit in the lockerroom. The guys don't BS on this, he came in, worked hard and picked up the playbook according to hos coaches and watching media. There has been no mood swings affecting the team, nor was there evidence of that in Carolina. Pre-Covid break he was looking very good.

There's been a bizarre lapse and it's not just Newton since Covid. Amidst all the Cam angst, people are forgetting the Niners put 33 points on our defense at home. They were running through us and around us at will. And the secondary continued to have issues on some long passing plays. Imagine us going up against Derrick Henry now? We'd be killed. I knew we were in trouble on Sunday when the Niners had 3rd down and JG scrambled and beat a couple of defenders and stretched for the 1st down. They had him behind the line and couldn't stop him. This is JG, not Kyler Murray or Jackson or Mahomes.

The whole team needs to reset and start again, it will need all of Bills skills to get this thing going again. There were even some errors on ST on Sunday with a spilt ball on one occasion. At least Folk looks better with his kicking.

 

[Patriots71]

He's only been a "bad fit" post-Covid with his play. He has been a very good fit in the lockerroom. The guys don't BS on this, he came in, worked hard and picked up the playbook according to hos coaches and watching media. There has been no mood swings affecting the team, nor was there evidence of that in Carolina. Pre-Covid break he was looking very good.

There's been a bizarre lapse and it's not just Newton since Covid. Amidst all the Cam angst, people are forgetting the Niners put 33 points on our defense at home. They were running through us and around us at will. And the secondary continued to have issues on some long passing plays. Imagine us going up against Derrick Henry now? We'd be killed. I knew we were in trouble on Sunday when the Niners had 3rd down and JG scrambled and beat a couple of defenders and stretched for the 1st down. They had him behind the line and couldn't stop him. This is JG, not Kyler Murray or Jackson or Mahomes.

The whole team needs to reset and start again, it will need all of Bills skills to get this thing going again. There were even some errors on ST on Sunday with a spilt ball on one occasion. At least Folk looks better with his kicking.

Stop blaming covid for this. He was asymptomatic. Its not like Cam has not had this happen before in his career. Yes I know the team is not great, I know they do not have wepaons, I know they cannot get open. I know, because it was the same way last year, nothing really changed except a better QB left. Yes their D is also not playing good due to the departure of some players. I mean Cam runs good, but he had 2 td's and 2 ints before covid, now that is not his strength, we know that, but in this league, at some point you have to have a pass game, defenses are going to figure it out if you cannot pass as well and they are going to attack it. So no I do not think he was a good fit on a team with receivers that cannot get a lot of separation because he is not that accurate. he needs a lot of time to survey the field. No its not all him, if it was just him we would not lose 33-6, but he is not doing anything to help the situation either, which is why I said, lets see what Stidham can do, or we are not going to know anything more next year than we know now. You are right the team does need to reset, but there is also the possibility that maybe, they are just not that good this year. We go back to , oh well we played seattle tight. Seattle has no defense so a lot of teams play them tight. Oh we only lost by 19 to KC. Games are about matchups, they change. I just saw the Jets go toe to toe with the Bills last week. I saw a bad eagles team take the undefeated steelers to the limit. Going back to games and saying well hey we didnt lose by that much here, is not a good comparison to use for what the team is. Looking at Cam in those interviews, he looks like he is about to cry. He does not seem stable. How many times have we seen Brady put up a stinker and come back the next week and light it up. I am not sure of Cam's mental stability and if its strong enough to ride this out.

With that said, I dont want to get into another argument over my feelings about Cam and his fit here. I am ok with that being my opinion that is not shared by others. So I understand you disagree, and that is ok, but its just how I feel about it. Yes there are major issues with the team, and I think deep down we knew there would be, but if its a rebuild, then we need to see what we have in our young QB and not just be a team that is helping another QB try and salvage his career.

 

[foobahl]

Stop blaming covid for this. He was asymptomatic. Its not like Cam has not had this happen before in his career. Yes I know the team is not great, I know they do not have wepaons, I know they cannot get open. I know, because it was the same way last year, nothing really changed except a better QB left. Yes their D is also not playing good due to the departure of some players. I mean Cam runs good, but he had 2 td's and 2 ints before covid, now that is not his strength, we know that, but in this league, at some point you have to have a pass game, defenses are going to figure it out if you cannot pass as well and they are going to attack it. So no I do not think he was a good fit on a team with receivers that cannot get a lot of separation because he is not that accurate. he needs a lot of time to survey the field. No its not all him, if it was just him we would not lose 33-6, but he is not doing anything to help the situation either, which is why I said, lets see what Stidham can do, or we are not going to know anything more next year than we know now. You are right the team does need to reset, but there is also the possibility that maybe, they are just not that good this year. We go back to , oh well we played seattle tight. Seattle has no defense so a lot of teams play them tight. Oh we only lost by 19 to KC. Games are about matchups, they change. I just saw the Jets go toe to toe with the Bills last week. I saw a bad eagles team take the undefeated steelers to the limit. Going back to games and saying well hey we didnt lose by that much here, is not a good comparison to use for what the team is. Looking at Cam in those interviews, he looks like he is about to cry. He does not seem stable. How many times have we seen Brady put up a stinker and come back the next week and light it up. I am not sure of Cam's mental stability and if its strong enough to ride this out.

With that said, I dont want to get into another argument over my feelings about Cam and his fit here. I am ok with that being my opinion that is not shared by others. So I understand you disagree, and that is ok, but its just how I feel about it. Yes there are major issues with the team, and I think deep down we knew there would be, but if its a rebuild, then we need to see what we have in our young QB and not just be a team that is helping another QB try and salvage his career.

Cams' mental stability? That's a bit rough.

 

[Patriots71]

Cams' mental stability? That's a bit rough.

He looks shelled. I dont mean he is a nut. I mean pressure is really getting to him and its causing some major pressing. When I say mental stability of a player, it does not mean they are seeing little green men. Hell I have seen Brady like that, but Brady has the ability to come back from that state, we will see if Cam can. Cam cares about how he is playing, and it seems to have taken a toll on him.

 

[SkiptoMyLou]

Stop blaming covid for this. He was asymptomatic. Its not like Cam has not had this happen before in his career. Yes I know the team is not great, I know they do not have wepaons, I know they cannot get open. I know, because it was the same way last year, nothing really changed except a better QB left. Yes their D is also not playing good due to the departure of some players. I mean Cam runs good, but he had 2 td's and 2 ints before covid, now that is not his strength, we know that, but in this league, at some point you have to have a pass game, defenses are going to figure it out if you cannot pass as well and they are going to attack it. So no I do not think he was a good fit on a team with receivers that cannot get a lot of separation because he is not that accurate. he needs a lot of time to survey the field. No its not all him, if it was just him we would not lose 33-6, but he is not doing anything to help the situation either, which is why I said, lets see what Stidham can do, or we are not going to know anything more next year than we know now. You are right the team does need to reset, but there is also the possibility that maybe, they are just not that good this year. We go back to , oh well we played seattle tight. Seattle has no defense so a lot of teams play them tight. Oh we only lost by 19 to KC. Games are about matchups, they change. I just saw the Jets go toe to toe with the Bills last week. I saw a bad eagles team take the undefeated steelers to the limit. Going back to games and saying well hey we didnt lose by that much here, is not a good comparison to use for what the team is. Looking at Cam in those interviews, he looks like he is about to cry. He does not seem stable. How many times have we seen Brady put up a stinker and come back the next week and light it up. I am not sure of Cam's mental stability and if its strong enough to ride this out.

With that said, I dont want to get into another argument over my feelings about Cam and his fit here. I am ok with that being my opinion that is not shared by others. So I understand you disagree, and that is ok, but its just how I feel about it. Yes there are major issues with the team, and I think deep down we knew there would be, but if its a rebuild, then we need to see what we have in our young QB and not just be a team that is helping another QB try and salvage his career.

 

[Roberto71]

Stop blaming covid for this. He was asymptomatic. Its not like Cam has not had this happen before in his career. Yes I know the team is not great, I know they do not have wepaons, I know they cannot get open. I know, because it was the same way last year, nothing really changed except a better QB left. Yes their D is also not playing good due to the departure of some players. I mean Cam runs good, but he had 2 td's and 2 ints before covid, now that is not his strength, we know that, but in this league, at some point you have to have a pass game, defenses are going to figure it out if you cannot pass as well and they are going to attack it. So no I do not think he was a good fit on a team with receivers that cannot get a lot of separation because he is not that accurate. he needs a lot of time to survey the field. No its not all him, if it was just him we would not lose 33-6, but he is not doing anything to help the situation either, which is why I said, lets see what Stidham can do, or we are not going to know anything more next year than we know now. You are right the team does need to reset, but there is also the possibility that maybe, they are just not that good this year. We go back to , oh well we played seattle tight. Seattle has no defense so a lot of teams play them tight. Oh we only lost by 19 to KC. Games are about matchups, they change. I just saw the Jets go toe to toe with the Bills last week. I saw a bad eagles team take the undefeated steelers to the limit. Going back to games and saying well hey we didnt lose by that much here, is not a good comparison to use for what the team is. Looking at Cam in those interviews, he looks like he is about to cry. He does not seem stable. How many times have we seen Brady put up a stinker and come back the next week and light it up. I am not sure of Cam's mental stability and if its strong enough to ride this out.

With that said, I dont want to get into another argument over my feelings about Cam and his fit here. I am ok with that being my opinion that is not shared by others. So I understand you disagree, and that is ok, but its just how I feel about it. Yes there are major issues with the team, and I think deep down we knew there would be, but if its a rebuild, then we need to see what we have in our young QB and not just be a team that is helping another QB try and salvage his career.

Oh FFS, You have a Cam obsession mate. Even when you concede there are other areas of the team not great, you still can't resist having a dig at Newton saying he's not helping like you tried to claim the defense was tired on Sunday, ergo it was Cam's fault for not leading long drives. You're trying to claim Newton can't throw yet I'll happily put up the stats again in Seattle if you wish. Your desperate attempt to try and negate that performance is so obvious.

And now without any evidence whatsoever, you're now speculating on a players mental health, and how he does not seem stable. That's a low, fairly scurrilous accusation to throw at anyone without any evidence whatsoever. You have zero evidence of this, bar a highly subjective view where you see just what you want to see. You have an agenda on this and you're just wildly throwing out all kinds of shit hoping some of it sticks. You tried to claim Newton had issues at Carolina and when you were shown this wasn't the case, you scuttled off.

In week one when the the Pats had a nice opening win and more pertinently, Tommy boy had an iffy day in NO, you weren't to be seen for days. Not a peep from you. Yet on Sunday? you were crawling all over the match thread sticking in the boot, trying vainly to claim "I told you so". At least many of us had the guts to be on that match thread when things weren't going well, we didn't whimper off waiting days to make a reappearance.

 

[Patriots71]

Yeah I had a response, but its just too silly at this point to argue. I think we should start Stidham and see what we have. If you want to bring up Brady's first game and shit toward me, go for it.

 

[chevss454]

It was a colossal mistake by Bill to leave this team in this position at QB - the most important position in all of sports. This really can't be denied in any form or fashion. It has been 3 years since Jimmy was traded and during that time Bill chose NOT to extend Brady which is fine BUT did nothing to address the QB position except draft Danny Etling in the 7th round and Stidham in the 4th round. Then when this off-season came with the most high quality QB FA agents on the market he did nothing again and waited until June 28 to sign a washed up Newton for a bargain. This isn't even so much about Brady as it is about Bill leaving this team vacant at the QB position. It is a complete head scratcher given how he has operated his program for the last two decades. It has been compounded by the fact that Brady is having an MVP caliber year as the Bucs look poised to make a good playoff run. It is understandable that fans are exasperated watching this team fumble so badly on offense with the worst collection of QBs of any team. All of that is on Bill. I truly believe the report that said he was surprised by Brady leaving. He assumed Brady would take crap deals forever on a crap offense.

BB's plan of succession was JimmyG then TB began playing like TFB again.

 

[Patriots71]

BB's plan of succession was JimmyG the TB began playing like TFB again.

Yeah not sure that would have worked well either. Between inconsistency and injury. But who knows what he would have been like if he stayed, no way to know. It did put BB in a weird spot though, coming off a MVP season for Brady and then you have JG's contract coming up, but I am not sure we could have paid him without taking some major hits.

 

[chevss454]

Yeah I had a response, but its just too silly at this point to argue. I think we should start Stidham and see what we have. If you want to bring up Brady's first game and shit toward me, go for it.

I'm with BB that Cam should be given a chance to improve to his previous early season good play. I'm a believer that Cam needs daily skills coaching to keep himself right.
If he's given time I think he'll be fine; if he's not, Stidham is waiting.

 

[chevss454]

Yeah not sure that would have worked well either. Between inconsistency and injury. But who knows what he would have been like if he stayed, no way to know. It did put BB in a weird spot though, coming off a MVP season for Brady and then you have JG's contract coming up, but I am not sure we could have paid him without taking some major hits.

BB couldn't tell the future of JG's play or injuries.
Exactly. He couldn't sign both and Kraft wanted Brady. There's no use looking back - Brady won another SB after all.

 

[chevss454]

It sure seems like Guerrero is among the best in the business. Why wouldn’t you want that guy around after seeing all his success stories?
Brady was in the middle of giving him his second 3 SB run. I guess that was pretty annoying. Why does Bills job satisfaction come before what’s best for the team?
Bills in the mist of finding out how much “better” things are without Brady. Hopefully he’s enjoying this season much more than the last five or 6.

Best in the charlatan business? Look up his history sometime. Concussion water is a real thing for him but there's so much more, such as lying about being a Doctor.

 

[Patriots71]

BB couldn't tell the future of JG's play or injuries.
Exactly. He couldn't sign both and Kraft wanted Brady. There's no use looking back - Brady won another SB after all.

Yeah as I said it was a tough spot, and yeah there is no way you can tell what a QB will do. He is a good player, but not sure how he would have worked and there is no way to know. Bad timing. I know people
liked to say, oh Kraft shipped him off but one thing people never talked about was what JG wanted. It was reported he was offered a contract to stay and take over when Brady left or if Brady left. He turned it down.
I would have been surprised if BB would have paid JG what the niners paid him without knowing everything like you said. So some of his departure could have been what he wanted to do. I am not one of those blame BB
for things like others. I do not blame him for Brady, that was Brady's decision. I do not blame him for JG, and I dont really blame him for the receivers. BB has done things how he has done and it has worked
better than any team and coach in history, so why now is it wrong? Things happen, players dont work out, others do, etc etc. Bill has a track record that would take many many years to even come close to even breaking even
of Bad things. He would have to become gase for the next 20 years. He does and will always do what he thinks is best and that works out way more than it doesnt.

 

[Patriots71]

Best in the charlatan business? Look up his history sometime. Concussion water is a real thing for him but there's so much more, such as lying about being a Doctor.

While this is true, how do we explain Brady playing like he is 25 at 43? Do we delve over into Peds yet?

 

[foobahl]

I'm with BB that Cam should be given a chance to improve to his previous early season good play. I'm a believer that Cam needs daily skills coaching to keep himself right.
If he's given time I think he'll be fine; if he's not, Stidham is waiting.

If he needs daily skills coaching, is that even sustainable over a season? How do you divvy it up between basics and game plan?

 

[Patriots71]

I'm with BB that Cam should be given a chance to improve to his previous early season good play. I'm a believer that Cam needs daily skills coaching to keep himself right.
If he's given time I think he'll be fine; if he's not, Stidham is waiting.

and he just might, he could very well be going through a funk. Its all about matchups anyway. Denver and the Niners were not good matchups. I am not going to even pretend to say that I know anything about a player on what they do or do not do. I have seen too much over the years. With that said...If Cam was like struggling a bit and was not really putting up great numbers, and was off on a few passes, I would be more inclined to agree. What I saw though was more then that, and you might disagree, but I'm not sure where he is at. He could very well come out next week and kill the Bills, the bills are struggling, its a good time to play them. My whole thing in all of this was I dont think Cam is the future of the team, and that is why I wanted them to see what they had with Stidham, who might be. Two things were going to happen. Cam would come in here and look amazing, and then the pats could not afford him, or he would struggle and then we wonder why we even tried it. Its not fair, but its the NFL. Honestly I am not sure having to daily coach him is what we want do we?

 

[Big/Sky/Fly]

I bet you believe in conspiracy theories.

The ironic thing is, most conspiracies aren't theories...

 

[Big/Sky/Fly]

Cams' mental stability? That's a bit rough.

Just look at the way he dresses up...

 

[chevss454]

While this is true, how do we explain Brady playing like he is 25 at 43? Do we delve over into Peds yet?

He watches his weight and what he eats. I do believe pliability is beneficial for sure. I have his book but couldn't get through the first chapter.

 

[Mazz22]

BB's plan of succession was JimmyG then TB began playing like TFB again.

I get that but it has been 3 years Chevvs since Jimmy was traded. What has Bill done at the QB spot? It has been reported that Brady wanted an extension after Jimmy was traded. He did not extend Brady which is fine but then no plan to either draft or trade for a competent QB in 3 off-seasons? That is the part that is so un-Bill like and why we are in the mess we are at the most critical position.