Flagg the Wanderer
Mourning Algernon
right, never had a cannon. Raw strength wasn't terrible, but his mechanics were, and everything was harder than it had to be.What about Phillip Rivers for example? The guy looked like he was in the middle of a shotput competition every time he threw. I was never a fan, but look at his career. Outside of his god awful postseason record and loserdom status, he had a nice productive career who knew how to throw based on his motion. I didn't think he'd make it, but he didn't have a strong arm.
Ah, maybe the problem is the definition of the word "average." Or settling on the group you're looking for the average. Because when you are comparing the universe of NFL starters, those guys are well below average.I see Mac as an above average arm guy with room to make it a little better as he grows into his body. You want average? Kyle Orton. Teddy Bridgewater. Mark Sanchez. Guys like that.
Agreed that he has a better arm than what so many have been convinced of by Rex Ryan, and that he wisely only throws as hard as he needs to throw most of the time. And that his arm is strong enough that it's not going to significantly limit him. And that it's not that important.When Mac needs to zip it in there, we've seen him do it. The ball to Bourne vs Dallas totally surprised the Cowboys secondary, for example. The dart he threw to Bourne for the TD vs Cleveland was a seed.
No.I am sorry, but Phil Perry is wrong. Below average basically means you can't succeed as an NFL QB week to week.
First of all, I didn't come to this conclusion by listening to Phil Perry or any other pundit.
You can watch and see.
2 - Words mean things. "Below average QB" might mean something like that, except that you may be strong in the skills of a heady game manager so that, combined with the money saved by not having a high-end contract, you can be very successful week to week.
But we're not talking about Below average QB. "Below average arm strength" literally means that assuming you decided on some metric(s) by which you would measure the maximum strength of the throws of all NFL starting quarterbacks, it would be the sum of that metric for all players divided by the number of players. Realistically, we're probably talking about the median rather than average, so #17 or lower out of 32 would be below the median. The median is almost certainly below the average, but putting that aside, we'll go with the median.
Without a decent metric, you get a little subjective at this point. But in terms of some combination of, let's say:
- how far they can throw the ball,
- how far they can throw while maintaining decent accuracy,*
- how fast they can zip a ball into a tight window,*
- how much reaction time they can make up by reducing the ball's flight time*
- how hard the ball hits the receiver's hands,
- how far they can throw "on a rope" without needing to put significant arc under the ball, and maybe
- how far they can throw when they don't have their base under them (which isolates the arm by removing lower body and form/technique from the equation)**
... I'd say all of the below would exceed Mac Jones by most ways you might measure:
Tier 1 - Effing Duh:
Allen
Mahomes
Rodgers
Stafford
Herbert
Murray
Tier 2 - Inarguable:
Mayfield
Watson
Lawrence
Lance
Wilson
Winston
Tier 3 - Obviously stronger arms:
Prescott
Tannehill
Carr
Ryan
Brady
Wentz
Cousins
Fields
Wilson
Burrow
Jackson
Tier 4 - Close to Mac:
Dalton
Rothlisberger
Newton
Garoppolo
Those are ones I felt pretty comfortable with ranking at a glance. Mac's arm is clearly better than some - Tua and Bridgewater come to mind immediately. But the difference between the 20ish range and the 30th range isn't huge, and there are only a handful that have sub-par arm strength to the extent that they're outliers, and are really crippled by this issue.
Point is, though, I listed 23 guys in the first 3 tiers before hitting one that even gave me pause. There would be more than 32 if this list were complete (Watson, some injured starters and former backups included) but you're not going to get to 47 to move Mac above the halfway point. That's the median, and I'm fine using that. If we really wanted something like an average I'd say it falls somewhere in the range of the guys that rank #12-15, because those top tier guys pull it up more than the guys at the bottom pull it down.
...
All that said, rank them as pure throwers (accuracy & placement) and Mac moves up that list. Factor in throwing in game situations (ball placement for WR safety, ball security, enabling YAC, "throwing people open," and manipulating a defense to create gaps for receivers to attack) and he moves up even more, probably near the top.
But in terms of pure arm strength? Yes, right now it is below that of the average NFL starter. Don't take it personally. It just is what it is.
- Flagg
PS - Of those ways to think about measuring arm strength:
* Most important things to look at
** Only important if the QB relies on mobility