Rd 1, #29 - Cole Strange, IOL, Chattenooga

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aloyouis said:
I love all of you Master Drafters that sit onhere and dream up mythical (but waaaay better) scenarios that BB should have pursued. There are a 1000 variables to drafting and you get stuck on a position or a player and disregard the rest and then blame BB who HAS to take in to consideration the other 999 variables.

But there is an easy one: Trade with who?

You need to have a willing fucking trading partner that is offering value. Sometimes I wonder if certain people ever had to do any kind of a business deal in their lives.
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The team that has traded more than anyone in the draft the last 20 years, couldn't find a trade partner ??? You're just making things up now as a blind homer.

.
 
aloyouis said:
He did pick a player that was projected to be a first round pick: Strange.
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Projected by the Patriots and that is the only projection that matters to BB.

Sean McV can eat shit.
 
DropKickFlutie said:
The team that has traded more than anyone in the draft the last 20 years, couldn't find a trade partner ??? You're just making things up now as a blind homer.

.
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ONE VARIABLE. You are stuck on one thing again. I bet you like plain hamburgers. Ketchup and pickles is beyond your grasp.

Of course he could find a trade partner. Was the deal worth it?

I know I added pickles there so...
 
aloyouis said:
ONE VARIABLE. You are stuck on one thing again. I bet you like plain hamburgers. Ketchup and pickles is beyond your grasp.

Of course he could find a trade partner. Was the deal worth it?

I know I added pickles there so...
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Easy now, i like my burgers with cheese only :) ....carry on...
 
Flagg the Wanderer said:
It's a good example because we know what actually happened. You're telling me that if you were in the draft room in April 2000, and you knew exactly what they knew then, EXCEPT a time traveler literally stepped out of a portal and handed you Tom Brady's resume of all his career accomplishments, but excluded any info about what team drafted him or with what selection, you would wait until pick #199? You'd risk that?

The more certain you are about your player evaluation, the less comfortable you should be trading back and assuming that he will be there. You trade back when there are a number of guys you have rated more or less equally, not just because you think no one else is as smart as you.
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I am extremely familiar with value groupings. No this example you raised is exactly what I'm talking about. What made BB great is getting elite guys (not just TB12) at fantastic draft value. Not overdrafting. In a hard cap league you accumulate as much value as possible over what you spend in draft or FA etc. Not by getting cute and overdrafting busts like NKeal, Jordan Richards, Cyrus Jones, etc. Knowing the career Edelman had, still made sense to not overdraft. If you love Strange but realistically nobody is taking this guy before pick #40, you trade back a bit if you don't want to risk waiting for him at #54.
 
aloyouis said:
Projected by the Patriots and that is the only projection that matters to BB.

Sean McV can eat shit.
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Did you just quote and reply to your own post.

Awesome, weird schizo poster noted.
 
DropKickFlutie said:
I am extremely familiar with value groupings. No this example you raised is exactly what I'm talking about. What made BB great is getting elite guys (not just TB12) at fantastic draft value. Not overdrafting. In a hard cap league you accumulate as much value as possible over what you spend in draft or FA etc. Not by getting cute and overdrafting busts like NKeal, Jordan Richards, Cyrus Jones, etc. Knowing the career Edelman had, still made sense to not overdraft. If you love Strange but realistically nobody is taking this guy before pick #40, you trade back a bit if you don't want to risk waiting for him at #54.
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You can't possibly know this yet you predicate your entire argument on it.

Who taught you how to make decisions?
 
DropKickFlutie said:
I hated the Mankins pick too even with the reports Mankins would have been gone soon thereafter too to SF. You just don't go guard or RB with a 1st round pick. It's terrible value. If the Pats traded back to #39, collected more draft picks, and took Strange at #39, nobody would be taking this kid that early from #29-39.
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John Hannah was a guard and a first round pick. #4 overall, I believe.

I'm not saying this guy is the next Hannah, but I don't think you can say that a certain position should never be drafted in the first round.
 
TipRoast said:
John Hannah was a guard and a first round pick. #4 overall, I believe.
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We can talk great players all we want. Mankins was excellent. Still not worth it imo. A difference in draft philosophy, I suppose. I don't like guards or RBs in the first round. I say all this even though I think this kid Strange will be good. I hate wasting a pick that early.
 
DropKickFlutie said:
I am extremely familiar with value groupings. No this example you raised is exactly what I'm talking about. What made BB great is getting elite guys (not just TB12) at fantastic draft value. Not overdrafting. In a hard cap league you accumulate as much value as possible over what you spend in draft or FA etc. Not by getting cute and overdrafting busts like NKeal, Jordan Richards, Cyrus Jones, etc. Knowing the career Edelman had, still made sense to not overdraft. If you love Strange but realistically nobody is taking this guy before pick #40, you trade back a bit if you don't want to risk waiting for him at #54.
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Which is exactly what they did, except apparently they disagreed with your assessment to the extent that they replaced #40 with #30. But it comes down to best available alternatives, not some hypothetical valuation that exists in the ether somewhere.

There's no such thing as "overdrafting busts." Every bust is by definition overdrafted. Both "overdrafted" and "bust" are labels you can only reasonably apply in hindsight. I use Brady as the ultimate example of this. If you're telling me that in the time traveler scenario I described above you wouldn't draft Brady in round 1, I don't want you as GM.

I think your argument around positional value is a good one. I don't agree with drafting OGs and RBs in the first round, generally speaking. I would spend a 1st on John Hannah in the time machine scenario, but I wouldn't be psyched about it, because elite guards don't change your likelihood of winning championships that much over passable guards. RBs can, but they're so fungible and are such a high injury risk.
 
DropKickFlutie said:
We can talk great players all we want. Mankins was excellent. Still not worth it imo. A difference in draft philosophy, I suppose. I don't like guards or RBs in the first round. I say all this even though I think this kid Strange will be good. I hate wasting a pick that early.
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I agree it's a difference in philosophy. To me, a wasted pick is someone that can't get on the field and make a contribution. A first round draft choice that is on the field for every offensive play (which is what I expect, not necessarily what will happen) is not a wasted pick.
 
If there's any solace, I wonder if Houston took the guy they wanted. People might be flipping out more if we didn't get the extra 3rd and 4th and took that guard Green at 21.....
 
aloyouis said:
You can't possibly know this yet you predicate your entire argument on it.

Who taught you how to make decisions?
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He probably has a point. Ain't no-one in the league half as stupid as Bill.
 
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