Looking at the Patriots 2024

I think Maye will be snatched up by then , that's why Daniels becomes the next logical choice.But none of these guys come are a sure thing , they are just a step above Mac in ability.
All three are far more than a step above Mac in ph
After the Mac Jones experiment I'm good with whatever QB they bring along as long as he's given proper time to get ready, which is why it would make sense to have Brisset as a bridge QB.

Personally I like Daniels' dual threat ability, but Maye's throwing ability does stand out. Either of them will need to sit behind a vet and learn the ropes—patience will be a big potential factor.

Hopefully with their Green Bay connection they have the same philosophy in bringing a young QB up by having him sit until he's ready. It seems to have worked out really well for Love and the Pack.
Personaly I think Maye and Daniels each have legitimate skills to build around. Given the choice I would go with Maye first because of his raw potential but I'd be happy with either pick. What simply can't understand is the idea that many seem to have that it's too risky to select a QB in the 1st round, like some how we have a better shot in the later rounds or that next year there's going to be a perfect QB prospect. After the 1st round QBs fail 70% of the time. Draft classes rarely have one prospect rated this high muchless three, not to mention it's a complete reach to think we would be in position to take the hypothetical QB next year.
 
Change does not automatically equal a decline in performance or results.dignified.

Your absolutely right it doesn't.

However, when you're at a high water mark change for the sake of change ought to be looked upon with a wary eye, to say the least.

The defense was at a high water mark.
 
All three are far more than a step above Mac in ph
Personaly I think Maye and Daniels each have legitimate skills to build around. Given the choice I would go with Maye first because of his raw potential but I'd be happy with either pick. What simply can't understand is the idea that many seem to have that it's too risky to select a QB in the 1st round, like some how we have a better shot in the later rounds or that next year there's going to be a perfect QB prospect. After the 1st round QBs fail 70% of the time. Draft classes rarely have one prospect rated this high muchless three, not to mention it's a complete reach to think we would be in position to take the hypothetical QB next year.
2021.
 
NY jets completely agree with you . Did you forget 2018 & 2021 drafts.That had a QB's going in first 3 picks . How did that work out again:coffee:.
None of them are Franchise QBs. That's something you earn in the NFL . Teams hope their potential . Translates to success & production in the NFL.


"Potential" is such a pointless word because not many reach it, so going off just that is a reach in of itself.

That said, it's the nature of the draft, so gotta take your best shot and do the work to develop talent on the back end.

There's no other way about it because clearly free agency hasn't given any reason for hope.
 
"Potential" is such a pointless word because not many reach it, so going off just that is a reach in of itself.

That said, it's the nature of the draft, so gotta take your best shot and do the work to develop talent on the back end.

There's no other way about it because clearly free agency hasn't given any reason for hope.
You're right the last few QB classes . Never lived up to it . It's simpler then saying evaluating their skills and traits. I deleted it he won't accept. Anything but a QB at 3.
 
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You're right these few loaded QB classes . Never lived up to it . It's simpler then saying evaluating their skills and traits. I deleted it he won't accept. Anything but a QB at 3.

So you've decided already and won't change your mind, deleted, that he won't accept anything but QB at #3?

Cool. 😎

Or something like that.
 
The Falcons recently signed Kirk Cousins 4 yr/$180M, and WR Darnell Mooney 3 yr/$39M for 2024.

I can't help but wonder how much Kraft's penny pinching contributed to not re-signing players, Thuney and Shaq Mason being examples. Sure, there were other factors such as poor drafting and not targeting WRs as important offensive weapons the way the rest of the NFL has for years. When WRs were targeted, the Pats chose badly. Harry over Deebo Samuel
and AJ Brown was laughable. Dobson over Keenan Allen and at least 5 others. Bill's greatest downfall as a GM, imo, was not paying more personal attention to the WR position in the draft.

Bethel Johnson over Anquan Boldin.
Chad Jackson over Greg Jennings.
Brandon Tate over Mike Wallace.
That was BB’s major problem. Drafting WR’s. However, he could usually bring in FA WR’s, and also the Moss and Welker trades: SUCCESS!

It was a paradox of sorts.
 
That was BB’s major problem. Drafting WR’s. However, he could usually bring in FA WR’s, and also the Moss and Welker trades: SUCCESS!

It was a paradox of sorts.

He liked the blue collar hard working guys or uber productive non-divas. The Branch, Edelman, Troy Brown, Welker, Moss types were his style until they began to complain or act
like divas. Edelman & Troy never complained and retired here. It's easy for me to see why Amendola didn't get along with Bill - he complained too much. And why Welker & Moss were allowed to leave. Bill had no patience to tolerate drama.
 
Mike Reiss on Mayo and why his style may work well in today's NFL.

1. Mayo's approach: When free agent running back Antonio Gibson arrived at Gillette Stadium in mid-March to sign his three-year contract with the Patriots, he had his daughter Taylor with him. Gibson said the way head coach Jerod Mayo showed Taylor love made an impression on him, as well as how Mayo felt like "one of the guys."

Receiver K.J. Osborn came away from his initial meeting with the feeling that Mayo is "a real down-to-earth guy." He added: "As a former player, he was really easy to talk to; he's a players' coach and I love that."

Likewise, veteran tight end Austin Hooper sat down with Mayo in the team cafeteria during his visit, with Hooper saying: "I was able to understand who he is -- a family man -- and what he's trying to build here. It was really productive."

The stories reflect what Mayo previously said would be a foundational part of his coaching style: Building bonds with players, showing he cares about them as people, before hopefully pushing them to achieve their greatest potential as players.

Can it work?

Owner Robert Kraft is banking on it after moving on from the legendary Bill Belichick after 24 seasons. The last time Kraft made a coaching switch, in 2000, it was from the lighter touch of Pete Carroll to the more buttoned-up, hard-lined Belichick. This time, Kraft said he is trusting his instincts by tapping Mayo, with the thinking that a more relational-based approach -- and overall team culture -- is the needed spark to help return the franchise to prominence.

Part of that is tied to the current generation of players coming into the NFL, with former Patriots cornerback Jason McCourty, who is part of NFL Network's "Good Morning Football" show, acknowledging, "The league is in a little bit of a transition. Players now are different than when I first came in."

McCourty, 36, entered the NFL in 2009 with the Tennessee Titans -- one year after Mayo was selected in the first round by the Patriots. He believes Mayo's approach can work, citing what he experienced himself with the Dolphins in 2022.

"I didn't get a chance to play for Mike McDaniel, but I got a chance to meet with him. I was injured and was still in the building in March [when he was hired], and we sat down and talked for probably 30-40 minutes. The first time I ever met him -- the quirkiness, and the things about him we've all seen transpire over the last two years -- that's who he was," McCourty said.

"So I look at it for Jerod, the best thing you can do for yourself is be yourself, and be honest. I think the worst thing that can possibly happen is for players to see you act one way for however many years that he's been there as a linebackers coach, and next thing you know you become the head guy and you totally flip because now more things fall on you and you have to make more decisions."

McCourty added that most players understand the NFL is a business and they appreciate honesty. He pointed to how his Patriots career ended as an example of why he holds no hard feelings toward New England -- or any of his former teams.

"As rough around the edges as people say Bill [Belichick] is, when I was a free agent that last year, he called me to check in multiple times throughout free agency. The first time it was to say, 'Hey, you know how much we love you here, but at this time we're not looking to sign you.' And the last time was 'If you have other opportunities, you should explore them.' So I think as a player you can appreciate that," he said.

"From Jerod, I think as long as he keeps that the main thing, him being a players' coach -- or however you want to phrase it -- I think that's who he is. So inviting family in, showing guys 'Hey, this is who I am, this is who I'm going to be every single day whether we win or whether we lose,' I think that can go a long way."

McCourty compared this style to how Andy Reid is like in Kansas City.

"They call him 'Big Red.' They laugh with him and talk about eating cheeseburgers and all those things," McCourty said. "I called their game in Germany and they were going through some things, and I remember talking to Travis Kelce and he was like, 'Big Red had to get after us in the team meeting room, and he let us know exactly where we stood as a football team.'

"I think that's who Mayo probably was as a player. It's no different from when you're leading a huddle and you have to tell a guy about himself, but you're also enjoying moments with those guys in the locker room. I think you can do both, but you have to set a standard and an expectation for what it's going to be, and you live up to that every single day."

4. One extra week: Because Mayo is a new head coach, the Patriots can start their voluntary offseason program two weeks early, per league rules. But Mayo has elected to split the difference, taking only one extra week. So the Patriots are set to start April 8.

5. JMac's view: Through the first wave of free agency, McCourty still sees "a lot of holes" across the Patriots' roster, notably at quarterback and receiver. He believes Mayo and Wolf will need multiple years to replenish them.

Conversely, he pointed to the team retaining right tackle Mike Onwenu and safety Kyle Dugger (via the transition tag) as "a step in the right direction" because "it sets an expectation for guys in the locker room -- 'we drafted these guys, developed them, they're some of the best at their position, so when you do the right thing in the building we want to show you we want you here for the long term.'"

6. Core STs: The release of core special teamer Chris Board, who was a Belichick favorite, seems to reflect a philosophical shift with the new Patriots regime. Whereas Belichick was more willing to invest at the top of the market for core special teamers who might not contribute as much (if at all) in other areas, Mayo and Wolf appear less willing. Board, who played defense with the Ravens and Lions, wasn't viewed as a fit on defense in New England.

7. Quiet on Bryant: Free agent defensive back Myles Bryant, who played 75% of the defensive snaps last season and was fourth on the Patriots with 77 tackles, remains on the market after spending the past four seasons in New England. My read: He lost a top advocate in Belichick. The Patriots would be open to bringing him back on a salary that reflects him more as a depth player than key cog, but there's been no alignment to date.

8. They said it: "It's less about the rawness of the quarterback and more about the situation that quarterback is walking into. You look at what happened with Carolina last year, I see a lot of similarities -- in terms of the lack of separation amongst the skill players, some question marks along the offensive line..." -- ESPN NFL analyst Mina Kimes, on "The Mina Kimes Show featuring Lenny," opining on the possibility of the Patriots drafting a quarterback at No. 3 and not having him play right away to avoid a similar situation as No. 1 overall pick Bryce Young in 2023.

9. Did you know, Part I: Since 2010, the Patriots have selected eight quarterbacks in the NFL draft, tied with the Jets and Titans for most in the NFL.

10. Did you know, Part II: The Patriots, who own the No. 3 overall pick, have never picked third in franchise history (since 1960).

 
Mike Reiss on Mayo and why his style may work well in today's NFL.

1. Mayo's approach: When free agent running back Antonio Gibson arrived at Gillette Stadium in mid-March to sign his three-year contract with the Patriots, he had his daughter Taylor with him. Gibson said the way head coach Jerod Mayo showed Taylor love made an impression on him, as well as how Mayo felt like "one of the guys."

Receiver K.J. Osborn came away from his initial meeting with the feeling that Mayo is "a real down-to-earth guy." He added: "As a former player, he was really easy to talk to; he's a players' coach and I love that."

Likewise, veteran tight end Austin Hooper sat down with Mayo in the team cafeteria during his visit, with Hooper saying: "I was able to understand who he is -- a family man -- and what he's trying to build here. It was really productive."

The stories reflect what Mayo previously said would be a foundational part of his coaching style: Building bonds with players, showing he cares about them as people, before hopefully pushing them to achieve their greatest potential as players.

Can it work?

Owner Robert Kraft is banking on it after moving on from the legendary Bill Belichick after 24 seasons. The last time Kraft made a coaching switch, in 2000, it was from the lighter touch of Pete Carroll to the more buttoned-up, hard-lined Belichick. This time, Kraft said he is trusting his instincts by tapping Mayo, with the thinking that a more relational-based approach -- and overall team culture -- is the needed spark to help return the franchise to prominence.

Part of that is tied to the current generation of players coming into the NFL, with former Patriots cornerback Jason McCourty, who is part of NFL Network's "Good Morning Football" show, acknowledging, "The league is in a little bit of a transition. Players now are different than when I first came in."

McCourty, 36, entered the NFL in 2009 with the Tennessee Titans -- one year after Mayo was selected in the first round by the Patriots. He believes Mayo's approach can work, citing what he experienced himself with the Dolphins in 2022.

"I didn't get a chance to play for Mike McDaniel, but I got a chance to meet with him. I was injured and was still in the building in March [when he was hired], and we sat down and talked for probably 30-40 minutes. The first time I ever met him -- the quirkiness, and the things about him we've all seen transpire over the last two years -- that's who he was," McCourty said.

"So I look at it for Jerod, the best thing you can do for yourself is be yourself, and be honest. I think the worst thing that can possibly happen is for players to see you act one way for however many years that he's been there as a linebackers coach, and next thing you know you become the head guy and you totally flip because now more things fall on you and you have to make more decisions."

McCourty added that most players understand the NFL is a business and they appreciate honesty. He pointed to how his Patriots career ended as an example of why he holds no hard feelings toward New England -- or any of his former teams.

"As rough around the edges as people say Bill [Belichick] is, when I was a free agent that last year, he called me to check in multiple times throughout free agency. The first time it was to say, 'Hey, you know how much we love you here, but at this time we're not looking to sign you.' And the last time was 'If you have other opportunities, you should explore them.' So I think as a player you can appreciate that," he said.

"From Jerod, I think as long as he keeps that the main thing, him being a players' coach -- or however you want to phrase it -- I think that's who he is. So inviting family in, showing guys 'Hey, this is who I am, this is who I'm going to be every single day whether we win or whether we lose,' I think that can go a long way."

McCourty compared this style to how Andy Reid is like in Kansas City.

"They call him 'Big Red.' They laugh with him and talk about eating cheeseburgers and all those things," McCourty said. "I called their game in Germany and they were going through some things, and I remember talking to Travis Kelce and he was like, 'Big Red had to get after us in the team meeting room, and he let us know exactly where we stood as a football team.'

"I think that's who Mayo probably was as a player. It's no different from when you're leading a huddle and you have to tell a guy about himself, but you're also enjoying moments with those guys in the locker room. I think you can do both, but you have to set a standard and an expectation for what it's going to be, and you live up to that every single day."

4. One extra week: Because Mayo is a new head coach, the Patriots can start their voluntary offseason program two weeks early, per league rules. But Mayo has elected to split the difference, taking only one extra week. So the Patriots are set to start April 8.

5. JMac's view: Through the first wave of free agency, McCourty still sees "a lot of holes" across the Patriots' roster, notably at quarterback and receiver. He believes Mayo and Wolf will need multiple years to replenish them.

Conversely, he pointed to the team retaining right tackle Mike Onwenu and safety Kyle Dugger (via the transition tag) as "a step in the right direction" because "it sets an expectation for guys in the locker room -- 'we drafted these guys, developed them, they're some of the best at their position, so when you do the right thing in the building we want to show you we want you here for the long term.'"

6. Core STs: The release of core special teamer Chris Board, who was a Belichick favorite, seems to reflect a philosophical shift with the new Patriots regime. Whereas Belichick was more willing to invest at the top of the market for core special teamers who might not contribute as much (if at all) in other areas, Mayo and Wolf appear less willing. Board, who played defense with the Ravens and Lions, wasn't viewed as a fit on defense in New England.

7. Quiet on Bryant: Free agent defensive back Myles Bryant, who played 75% of the defensive snaps last season and was fourth on the Patriots with 77 tackles, remains on the market after spending the past four seasons in New England. My read: He lost a top advocate in Belichick. The Patriots would be open to bringing him back on a salary that reflects him more as a depth player than key cog, but there's been no alignment to date.

8. They said it: "It's less about the rawness of the quarterback and more about the situation that quarterback is walking into. You look at what happened with Carolina last year, I see a lot of similarities -- in terms of the lack of separation amongst the skill players, some question marks along the offensive line..." -- ESPN NFL analyst Mina Kimes, on "The Mina Kimes Show featuring Lenny," opining on the possibility of the Patriots drafting a quarterback at No. 3 and not having him play right away to avoid a similar situation as No. 1 overall pick Bryce Young in 2023.

9. Did you know, Part I: Since 2010, the Patriots have selected eight quarterbacks in the NFL draft, tied with the Jets and Titans for most in the NFL.

10. Did you know, Part II: The Patriots, who own the No. 3 overall pick, have never picked third in franchise history (since 1960).


From experience this is extremely hard to do. It's easier if you have a cache of experience and success behind you. Even still, it's incredibly difficult to remain objective when you have close, caring relationships with your employees. They are not all going to work out.

To keep the consistent, to keep the bottom line, winning in mind, and having to make decisions and command respect from those under you with such close bonds, is the key.

Hope he can do it. Cause if he can, the payoff is enormous for the bottom line and fulfilling for those involved.

My best to ya coach.
 
"As rough around the edges as people say Bill [Belichick] is, when I was a free agent that last year, he called me to check in multiple times throughout free agency. The first time it was to say, 'Hey, you know how much we love you here, but at this time we're not looking to sign you.' And the last time was 'If you have other opportunities, you should explore them.' So I think as a player you can appreciate that," he said.
i thought he was 100% asshole who doesn't g.a.f. about his players? :coffee:
 
i thought he was 100% asshole who doesn't g.a.f. about his players? :coffee:
Bill Belichick cared about the functional careers of his players. I'm sorry, but I don't get the impression that Mayo is anything other than a bullshit artist so far.
 
Bill Belichick cared about the functional careers of his players. I'm sorry, but I don't get the impression that Mayo is anything other than a bullshit artist so far.
How can you call Mayo a BS artist. He hasn't had a chance to coach anyone. Wolf & Kraft are running the FA moves.
 
How can you call Mayo a BS artist. He hasn't had a chance to coach anyone. Wolf & Kraft are running the FA moves.
I think I stopped short of stating he's a bullshit artist. I said it was my impression. That impression is based on the fact that it appears he went behind Bill Belichick's back last year to set up his ascension to the head coach position this year.

That seems pretty much a certainty and if so, he's an untrustworthy bullshit artist because if he would do it in that situation, he would do it in any situation.


But it's not yet factual.
 
"Potential" is such a pointless word because not many reach it, so going off just that is a reach in of itself.

That said, it's the nature of the draft, so gotta take your best shot and do the work to develop talent on the back end.

There's no other way about it because clearly free agency hasn't given any reason for hope.

Yep. There are no money-back guarantees if you aren't satisfied. The NFL isn't L.L. Bean.

You can't look at previous players at the same position from the same school or Mahomes would have flopped. You
can't look at what happened when you took a guy at the same position and he didn't work out or avoid high-pressure
picks because you're afraid what will happen if you're wrong. You also can't be unduly influenced by what Belichick did
for over 20 years. Losing your job if you get it wrong is something you have have to be willing to accept or you'll lose
it for being risk-averse, especially if the guy you skipped over hits big and then you have to listen to the critics.

If the Pats just don't think the top QBs are as good as the majority of the experts do, then and only then should they
think about trading down and maximizing the huge value of the 3rd pick. If you think that one of these guys, Maye
or Daniels can become a top guy then you accept that risk and send in the card.

Sound judgement in evaluating and projecting future NFL players is the key to building good football teams. Patience, unfortunately is
also a big part of that equation because if you take JaDrake Mayedan then the media will be all over your shit if he doesn't
immediately light the NFL up. And both may need time to percolate no matter what the weight of expectations are.

But.......you have to take the big shot if you think it can pay off even if doing so invites heavy scrutiny and may create other issues.

I look at those two guys and would be perfectly happy to roll the dice to land either one. High-stakes gambles are the nature
of the beast.
 
I don't know, Hawg. Those really good players only come along once every 5-6 years and those top players only come along every 10 years. I don't think the 3rd pick
has to be great or should live under the pressure of a high stakes gamble. A quality starter is all I expect and I'd be very satisfied with that level of quarterbacking ceiling.
I don't have expectations for Manning, Mahomes or Brady. A Stafford or Matt Ryan would do nicely.
 
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