Brady Passes Marino for TD Passes

[Darth Despot]

If your offense consists of "run down 10 and I'll hit you on the out" then it's really easy to pick WRs.

When it's "if he has inside leverage and the LB on your side blitzes look for the back shoulder at 10, if he drops in coverage run a seam, if you read zone run a shallow cross and if the ball isn't out in 3.5 seconds break long" it's a little harder.

To put it a different way, WRs with physical skills are a dime a dozen, ones with the football smarts to excel in the Brady chess match are rare.

 

[HSanders]

The Bengals and the Steelers don't have any trouble finding WRs. Maybe they need to try to hire some of their scouts.

I know, where on earth did Cincy come up with Brandon Tate?

 

[Jaric]

If only you guys had a really dominant tight end (or two) to make up for the lack of receivers.

 

[One-Be-Lo]

Imagine if Chad Jackson had worked out... Brady would be 500+ already... man that one still hurts. Is he still alive?

 

[BostonTim]

If we judge by 2007 then he would have had better stats as he threw for 50 TDs with 23 to Moss for the season record and one miraculous catch away from going perfect. And we had no run game or TE threat that year.

I am not looking for Moss again as I know that ain't ever happening but we can't do better than Brandon LaFell?? And literally no number #2? Or is Amendola the #2?

Moss was here at all because:

1. He sucked in oakland and appeared to be dead
2. He was a cheap pickup at cheap money w/no risk.
3. Bill knew it was a short term deal and he could bail at will.

My point is Bill NEVER built his team with one of those guys pencilled in as a major necessity/component. If one one of Bill's draft picks had turned into a star of that nature, Bill would have probably gotten out in front quickly to get an early Gronk type deal in place and if not, he would move on.

Just my belief/opinion. I still believe the absence of those type guys is built inherently into Bills philosophy.

 

[king of kings]

If there going to continue to throw deep. To keep the safeties from playing close to the line. Might as well sign him unless Johnson can catch the deep ball.

 

[Dwight Schrute]

Not giving Brady deep threat studs is, my guess, by design. I think had Bill wanted one, he would have got one (I know there were a few sort of at that ilk that didn't pan out, but no urgency at all). Nearly all the great WRs turn into Divas demanding the ball. Bill's philosophical approach to winning has little or no place for people demanding the ball (and bringing those demands into the locker room) and lots of doremi.. So he has built his receiving game that way. I question whether we should presume that always having a Jerry Rice would leave Tom with either better career stats (in fact I doubt it) or more rings.

Cheers, BostonTim

When the pass catchers on this team (RB, TE, WR) are all healthy they are fantastic.
Hell my boss at the time used to look at me all cockeyed when I said in 04 that I'd take the Pats RECEIVERS GROUP (RB, TE, WR) over any other GROUP in the NFL.

It's just unfortunate that a bunch of them are owie at once. And I absolutely said to my husband on Monday night when Dez threw YET ANOTHER FIT on the sidelines, THIS IS WHY BB DOESN'T BOTHER WITH THESE HIGH PRICED DIVAS...only one or two are decent team players...like Larry Fitz or Calvin Johnson. High priced RBs and WRs...feh...don't need those squawking selfish types.

I'm not looking for a Rice or Moss or Fitz, though it'd be nice.

Another Branch or 3 would be fine.

The Bengals and the Steelers don't have any trouble finding WRs. Maybe they need to try to hire some of their scouts.

Correct. Throwing some $ at their personnel people and promos might be an answer.

If your offense consists of "run down 10 and I'll hit you on the out" then it's really easy to pick WRs.

When it's "if he has inside leverage and the LB on your side blitzes look for the back shoulder at 10, if he drops in coverage run a seam, if you read zone run a shallow cross and if the ball isn't out in 3.5 seconds break long" it's a little harder.

To put it a different way, WRs with physical skills are a dime a dozen, ones with the football smarts to excel in the Brady chess match are rare.

This has to be the reason. I just question with Brady's age maybe there's a way to transition slowly to more typical style offense. Leave the sight adjusts to audibles at the line? I don't know.

But if we already have difficulty finding WRs, and there's no guarantee that Garop or any other QB brought in would function at or near Brady's level in this style, for ease of personnel and function moving forward it may be wise to start a transition soon.

 

[HSanders]

I could be wrong but the Garop is supposed to have a similar ability to TB as far as getting rid of it fast. If you have that skill, the skills of the Edelpersons and Amendolas of the world will work well for you. Right now, we won't see that of course, because he is far from having that same level of football knowledge, but even young TB didn't have all world skill guys either. His best TE until Gronk was Christian Fauria. If anything, I say the OL improves (TB had a good one early on) and they get more capable RUNNING backs (Antowaine Smith was decent, I'm talking maybe a level up), and the Garop might be able to succeed with "Pats style" WRs and Gronk (or a possession type WR) until his knowledge level improves.

 

[Dwight Schrute]

I could be wrong but the Garop is supposed to have a similar ability to TB as far as getting rid of it fast. If you have that skill, the skills of the Edelpersons and Amendolas of the world will work well for you. Right now, we won't see that of course, because he is far from having that same level of football knowledge, but even young TB didn't have all world skill guys either. His best TE until Gronk was Christian Fauria. If anything, I say the OL improves (TB had a good one early on) and they get more capable RUNNING backs (Antowaine Smith was decent, I'm talking maybe a level up), and the Garop might be able to succeed with "Pats style" WRs and Gronk (or a possession type WR) until his knowledge level improves.

Garop gets the ball out quick, meaning the speed of his release ala Marino.

Yet to be seen how fast he processes what the defense is giving him.

 

[dchester]

If only you guys had a really dominant tight end (or two) to make up for the lack of receivers.

The Pats have done well over the years with tight ends. Now as for wide receivers, there's Branch, Edelman, and . . .

:shrug_n:

 

 

[dchester]

Imagine if Chad Jackson had worked out... Brady would be 500+ already... man that one still hurts. Is he still alive?

P K Sam had a lot of potential, too.

Maybe these guys just needed a little more time to figure stuff out.

 

[king of kings]

P K Sam had a lot of potential, too. Maybe these guys just needed a little more time to figure stuff out.

What about Taylor price or Bethel Johnson.

 

[TommyD420]

I felt this achievement deserved its own thread. Brady now sits at 423 passing TDs. He is the ONLY QB in NFL history to have passed for more than 400 TDs and have multiple rings as in 4!

What makes this sweet and I am sure Tommy will agree is that he passed Marino. I could care less whether Tom ever passes Favre or Manning but passing Marino is so awesome given my disdain for all things Dolphins and especially Marino.

This, to me as a fan, is a monster achievement - because **** Dan Marino, that win-nothing primadonna.

And now with Brees passing him too, he's completely irrelevant in NFL history, and won't even make those graphics, when players inevitably pass him in the future.

So, a big ha-ha **** you to Dan Marino, although I wish Brady would have broken it the non-Marino way, with a win, I'll still take it.

I do want to take a second to note, that when Brady was still a "game manager" early on, he still threw a BUNCH of TD passes - stats that would surprise most people, I think.

 

[TommyD420]

Since 2000 I can't really think of a WR drafted and developed outside of a couple. Edelman. Branch. He's gotten some FAs and trades, but in 16 seasons?

Here's the thing, D, and trust me, I think about this a lot.

Do you think you're getting a Keenan Allen, say, for 4 years, 17 million after his rookie contract, like Edelman got? Even Amendola, as a FA who everyone thinks is overpaid, signed for 3/12.75 mil.

No, if you want to retain a Keenan Allen, or an Antonio Bryant, you're going to have to pay an at-least Amendola Total Contract, per year for the next 4 or 5 years?

You draft a reach guy like a Dobson or Taylor Price or Brandon Tate and hope he works out "ok", because even if you happen to nail a guy with a high pick, you're going to develop him in 4, 5 years and he'll be gone (Deion Branch, for example).

So what the Patriots have tried to do is pay top-of-the-market at TE (Gronkowski) and try to approximate the production with the B-level guys like Edelman, Amendola, and LaFell, and hope they advance to the degree where they can be game-changers.

It's why I laugh at the people who are like "OMG WE SHOULD HAVE DRAFTED CORDARELLE PATTERSON" or whatever. A) That's a blown first-round pick, we see now, and even a high pick like a Keenan Allen, who is excellent, will be gone in 4 years, so what's the point? Yeah, he'll be good while he's here, but it's not like he's going to stay.

It's a long-term philosophy that Belichick has always followed, and pisses off the fans that only watch the first two nights of the draft, and listen to announcers suck off Dez Bryant every week.

You draft the most talented guy you can find, although it will be someone with an injury flag or something else that forces them to drop, keep them and develop them and hope they work out a little, get them on an affordable 2nd contract, and go.

I mean, just look at their offense. Even the high pick guys. Solder, Vollmer, Cannon, Gronkowski, Chandler, LaFell, Edelman, Amendola, these are all "injury-flag" guys.

Sometimes you just gotta pay the piper - and this is one of those years.

 

[Patriots71]

It's a bit sad when you think a full time vet and Pats message board draft enthusiast can nail a WR class with higher accuracy than the full time personnel staff in Foxboro.

I just do not think he cares much about the receiver, not sure its not that he cannot evaluate them, he probably just thinks the position is overrated for what a good one gets paid. I mean think about anytime a receiver on this team tried to get paid...Branch, Moss, Welker...

 

[Patriots71]

Here's the thing, D, and trust me, I think about this a lot.

Do you think you're getting a Keenan Allen, say, for 4 years, 17 million after his rookie contract, like Edelman got? Even Amendola, as a FA who everyone thinks is overpaid, signed for 3/12.75 mil.

No, if you want to retain a Keenan Allen, or an Antonio Bryant, you're going to have to pay an at-least Amendola Total Contract, per year for the next 4 or 5 years?

You draft a reach guy like a Dobson or Taylor Price or Brandon Tate and hope he works out "ok", because even if you happen to nail a guy with a high pick, you're going to develop him in 4, 5 years and he'll be gone (Deion Branch, for example).

So what the Patriots have tried to do is pay top-of-the-market at TE (Gronkowski) and try to approximate the production with the B-level guys like Edelman, Amendola, and LaFell, and hope they advance to the degree where they can be game-changers.

It's why I laugh at the people who are like "OMG WE SHOULD HAVE DRAFTED CORDARELLE PATTERSON" or whatever. A) That's a blown first-round pick, we see now, and even a high pick like a Keenan Allen, who is excellent, will be gone in 4 years, so what's the point? Yeah, he'll be good while he's here, but it's not like he's going to stay.

It's a long-term philosophy that Belichick has always followed, and pisses off the fans that only watch the first two nights of the draft, and listen to announcers suck off Dez Bryant every week.

You draft the most talented guy you can find, although it will be someone with an injury flag or something else that forces them to drop, keep them and develop them and hope they work out a little, get them on an affordable 2nd contract, and go.

I mean, just look at their offense. Even the high pick guys. Solder, Vollmer, Cannon, Gronkowski, Chandler, LaFell, Edelman, Amendola, these are all "injury-flag" guys.

Sometimes you just gotta pay the piper - and this is one of those years.

Gronk did not come along until 2010....Brady played 9 years without a top paid gronk type TE. Lets face it, Gronk worked out but most of the TE's did not, we mainly just got lucky on that one, but they have never paid pass catchers well on this team.

 

[Patriots71]

This, to me as a fan, is a monster achievement - because **** Dan Marino, that win-nothing primadonna.

And now with Brees passing him too, he's completely irrelevant in NFL history, and won't even make those graphics, when players inevitably pass him in the future.

So, a big ha-ha **** you to Dan Marino, although I wish Brady would have broken it the non-Marino way, with a win, I'll still take it.

I do want to take a second to note, that when Brady was still a "game manager" early on, he still threw a BUNCH of TD passes - stats that would surprise most people, I think.

If you think about it, 28 used to be a lot of td's when brady first started playing. He lead the afc in 2002 with 28 td's. Now days Brady gets 28 by week 9. TD's have went way up over the last 10 years, which is why you see guys like Flacco setting td's in their first 5 years marks.

 

[Dwight Schrute]

Here's the thing, D, and trust me, I think about this a lot.

Do you think you're getting a Keenan Allen, say, for 4 years, 17 million after his rookie contract, like Edelman got? Even Amendola, as a FA who everyone thinks is overpaid, signed for 3/12.75 mil.

No, if you want to retain a Keenan Allen, or an Antonio Bryant, you're going to have to pay an at-least Amendola Total Contract, per year for the next 4 or 5 years?

You draft a reach guy like a Dobson or Taylor Price or Brandon Tate and hope he works out "ok", because even if you happen to nail a guy with a high pick, you're going to develop him in 4, 5 years and he'll be gone (Deion Branch, for example).

So what the Patriots have tried to do is pay top-of-the-market at TE (Gronkowski) and try to approximate the production with the B-level guys like Edelman, Amendola, and LaFell, and hope they advance to the degree where they can be game-changers.

It's why I laugh at the people who are like "OMG WE SHOULD HAVE DRAFTED CORDARELLE PATTERSON" or whatever. A) That's a blown first-round pick, we see now, and even a high pick like a Keenan Allen, who is excellent, will be gone in 4 years, so what's the point? Yeah, he'll be good while he's here, but it's not like he's going to stay.

It's a long-term philosophy that Belichick has always followed, and pisses off the fans that only watch the first two nights of the draft, and listen to announcers suck off Dez Bryant every week.

You draft the most talented guy you can find, although it will be someone with an injury flag or something else that forces them to drop, keep them and develop them and hope they work out a little, get them on an affordable 2nd contract, and go.

I mean, just look at their offense. Even the high pick guys. Solder, Vollmer, Cannon, Gronkowski, Chandler, LaFell, Edelman, Amendola, these are all "injury-flag" guys.

Sometimes you just gotta pay the piper - and this is one of those years.

Good post.

Allen may not be the best example because I believe we could've had him no?

But he's more in line with what I'm thinking.

The 6'4" 4.3 40 guys are ALWAYS going to command huge draft resources and $. I'm not for that. I'm talking the 6' garden variety receiver. Branch is a perfect example.

You'd think they'd prioritize a guy like that every few years. Get the rookie contract and then if the second is too high you farm for another. Seems much harder accomplished here than just about any other spot.

Even the Factory of Sadness can score a Travis Benjamin in the 4th.

 

[sprocketboy]

The Pats have done well over the years with tight ends. Now as for wide receivers, there's Branch, Edelman, and . . .

:shrug_n:

... Troy Effing Brown.

 

[Beaglebay]

NE made a play for Emmanuel Sanders last season. Just didn't get it done.