Looking at the Patriots - 2015

[Wiluven]

I'm by no means an expert when it comes to the cap but a 40M guarantee spread out correctly (easy to say) on Revis wouldn't scare me. If I recall correctly, that 40M guarantee is basically for three years of service and they can then cut him for a minimal loss.

Revis is a technique and intellect player - not a player that relies on his speed to cover. Even if he lost a step in year three (doubtful) he'd still be top 3 corner in the league and will be for the next 3-5 years.

Not saying we should of paid the man 40M as I don't know how the spider web works when it comes to signing our other up and coming players but he is most definitely worth the 40.

OK, so assuming Pats agreed to fully guarantee (for the first 3 years) a $13,333,334 per year contract, what would have happened once the Jets heard about it and agreed to guarantee 42 mil?

Not relevant to my post. The poster I quoted asked about paying Revis 40M guaranteed for a player that will be 30 when the season starts, insinuating that due to his age he isn't worth it. I'm not talking about a bidding war with the Jets - I simply said Revis is worth 40M guaranteed over 3 years as his play style doesn't rely on speed when you inevitably lose as you age.

 

[TommyD420]

Basically, they're trying to deal with their cap hell issue this year (and will likely suck worse than they did last year), with the hope of retooling later.

Now as to whether they're doing a good job at it, is another story.

:shrug:

So why would you trade away a 22-year old who had 60+ catches last year, and are on the books for $500K or whatever the next 2 years?

It is the Saints though, so I'll allow for your possibility. Good point.

 

[spacecrime]

Laughable that Patriot homers try and spin it to make it look like this was the only way the organization could stay competitive.

There are probably other ways to stay competitive every year, but I haven't seen a team do it any other way. All top teams move on from players highly priced if it affects the future.

What I find laughable is pointing to the way the Jets operate and saying that is the way the Pats should be doing it.

Before your time here, but the Pats took grief year after year when Daniel Snyder signed "the guy the Pats needed to win" every March.

It's rare that a team can come up with a winning philosophy and even more rare that they stick to it when the next shiny toy is available.

People mock "In BB We Trust," but all it really means is that he has delivered winning teams consistently and he might just know more about building a team than I do. Not you, just speaking for me.

The bad part about the Pats being good (at least for those of us who lived though the late 80's and early 90's) is that so many entitled fans show up and get angry when the Pats aren't guaranteed (in early March, no less - can't wait for them to make changes in April and August) to win a superbowl every year. All things being equal (i.e., the Pats behave like everyone else) you could expect the Pats to win a superbowl once every 32 years. The fact that they won 4 in 14 years is pretty un-effing-believable. Griping that we might not win 5 in 15 is what droves fans of other teams nuts about us.

The margin for winnig and losing in the NFL is pretty damn small, and it's incredible the run we had. History will look back on it and be amazed. I'm too old to wait for history, so I'm going to enjoy the ride now.

 

[Roberto71]

Welcome Scott Chandler.

 

[German_Patriot]

Contract details for Alan Branch:

2015:
$700k Signing Bonus
$1.2M Base Salary
$25k per game Roster Bonus (up to $400k in total)
$400k weight bonus
$750k NLTBE playing time incentives

2016 (option year)
$400k roster bonus due on the first day of the 2016 league year
$1.2M Base Salary
$25k per game Roster Bonus (up to $400k in total)
$400k weight bonus
$750k NLTBE playing time incentives

Resulting cap numbers: $2.15M in 2015, $2.55M in 2016.

The playing time incentives and half of the per game roster boni are not included into the cap number. The latter would immediately hit the cap if earned, while the NLTBE Incentives would affect the cap number in the following year.

Details reported by Aaron Wilson (@RavensInsider).

 

[Michigan Dave]

The easy way to think about it is...

Do we win SB49 if we had "won" the bidding wars/clogged our cap for trades for any of...
-Mike Wallace
-DeSean Jackson
-Brian Orakpo
-Red Bryant
-Dashon Goldson
-Kyle Rudolph
-Larry Fitzgerald
-Andre Johnson

All of whom were available and there was a large cry for grabbing. Some maybe we win with regardless, but most of those are overpaid veterans who underachieve under their current contract.

Even if you go all in on a season, it's extremely hard to win a SB and you have to catch some breaks. And even if your moves DO pan out (2007), it's still very likely you lose a game. Given that, it makes much more sense to be 'very good-great' every year than 'great' every three years, contrary to what idiots like Felger and Mazz try to preach.

This is pretty spot on. The "Revis is necessary" crowd is missing the big picture. If Seattle pounding is 3 times with Lynch last year, then the "all in" Revis team with the uber-secondary is probably a runner-up. And if Wes Welker makes a catch that he makes more often than not, then the 2011 patchwork secondary is world champion. The difference made by the $40MM man was negligible.

I'd rather have the cash spread out amongst 53 good players than have a handful of A+ players.

 

[German_Patriot]

Cap space update: $11.1M left.

 

[Dwight Schrute]

Cap space update: $11.1M left.

Is that with rookie pool factored in?

 

[German_Patriot]

Is that with rookie pool factored in?

No. Rookies will reduce the available cap space by $1M to $1.5M.

 

[MaineMimi]

This is pretty spot on. The "Revis is necessary" crowd is missing the big picture. If Seattle pounding is 3 times with Lynch last year, then the "all in" Revis team with the uber-secondary is probably a runner-up. And if Wes Welker makes a catch that he makes more often than not, then the 2011 patchwork secondary is world champion. The difference made by the $40MM man was negligible.

I'd rather have the cash spread out amongst 53 good players than have a handful of A+ players.

This^^

 

[mikiemo83]

If Revis and Browner were one year rentals...would Hardy be a good one year rental for next year? I'd do it...

i think twice about it, but wish vince was here to kick his ass

My displeasure with the Revis situation stems more from not aggressively pursuing and paying ( or slightly overpaying) an extension PRIOR to him reaching FA that better fit the parameters and structured to be absorbed more easily by this team.

It wasn't any secret there were gonna be teams with exhorbitant cap space available and a Planet Player to spend it on.

Gilbert would not let Revis deal on a new deal during the year. His NFLPA platform was $1,000,000 minimum salary and the tearing up of the CBA and most likely a strike/lockout.

it is all about the money with that family.

 

[mikiemo83]

This is pretty spot on. The "Revis is necessary" crowd is missing the big picture. If Seattle pounding is 3 times with Lynch last year, then the "all in" Revis team with the uber-secondary is probably a runner-up. And if Wes Welker makes a catch that he makes more often than not, then the 2011 patchwork secondary is world champion. The difference made by the $40MM man was negligible.

I'd rather have the cash spread out amongst 53 good players than have a handful of A+ players.

Most definitely, a collection of ballers beats a couple studs

 

[Dwight Schrute]

No. Rookies will reduce the available cap space by $1M to $1.5M.

That's all huh? Wow.

Thanks

 

[HSanders]

On Stills, I too was puzzled because the kid looks like a legit player. But some Saints fans have commented elsewhere that he liked to party so much that he was late for team meetings, and also created lockerroom issues (not specified what type). I honestly can't imagine another reason outside those types as to why you would trade a talent like him especially when you are selling almost everyone else on O, so it seems plausible.

 

[king of kings]

i think twice about it, but wish vince was here to kick his ass

Gilbert would not let Revis deal on a new deal during the year. His NFLPA platform was $1,000,000 minimum salary and the tearing up of the CBA and most likely a strike/lockout.

it is all about the money with that family.

Good thing he did not win. Last thing NFL needs is another strike or lockout.

 

[deec77]

I'm still waiting to hear what real money means? Anyone please? I really wish I could pay my employees fake money. So please enlighten me.

~Dee~

 

[Hawg73]

I'm still waiting to hear what real money means? Anyone please? I really wish I could pay my employees fake money. So please enlighten me.

~Dee~

Let's say you have an employee that is a bit of a slacker and a pain in the ass and this employee let's it be known that ACME industries down the street desperately wants their services and you'd love nothing more than to see them leave but this individual has skills that you'd have a hard time replacing for this calendar year. You're stuck and can't afford to let them leave.

So, to put it in NFL terms, you offer them a new five-year deal including a generous raise, guarantee only this year's wages (that's the real money) at last year's salary (you tell them it's a cash flow problem) and then spread the raise over the last four years. They think they've struck it rich and you are a fool, but they underestimated you.

Then, once you find a fitting replacement you fire their ass next year and you're only out the real money you spent to keep them this fiscal year. The rest of it is just theoretical and lots of players never see the final years of their contracts. Such is the NFL.

Of course, you might get sued or other bad, real-world stuff could happen, but that, in a nutshell, is what real money is about.

 

[anderson]

My displeasure with the Revis situation stems more from not aggressively pursuing and paying ( or slightly overpaying) an extension PRIOR to him reaching FA that better fit the parameters and structured to be absorbed more easily by this team.

It wasn't any secret there were gonna be teams with exhorbitant cap space available and a Planet Player to spend it on.

If rumors are true, though, that Revis and his management make some of the shrewdest business people in the NFL, I don't think your scenario is all that likely.
He wouldn't ever be minimizing his own value like that knowing that, given his year with the Pats, he would be a hot commodity.

 

[sg14]

Cap space update: $11.1M left.

Don't they like to keep $5.0 M or so into the start of the season (for the next "Talib ")??

 

[German_Patriot]

That's all huh? Wow.

Thanks

The Top51 Rule keeps that number low. Pick #32 should have a 1st year cap hit of maybe $1.3M, pick #64 would land somewhere close to $700k and so on. As of now each of them pushes a player with a $585k salary out of the Top51, therefore the net cap hit for #32 is closer to $700k, for #64 about $100k and the lower picks won't even crack the Top51 so for them you only have the signing bonus proration. Add $100k or so in guarantees for undrafted Free Agents and you're done.