Week 9 : Colts vs Patriots game thread

There was a guy sitting a few rows behind me at the Colts game. Every time Mac got sacked or misfired he would start
yelling Zapp-EEEE, Zapp-EEEE, Zap-EEEE!!!!!! at the top of his lungs. Nobody else chimed in and a few people heckled him. I turned around
once to see what sort of lunatic was screaming that loud and he seemed to be avoiding all interaction. Just a man on a mission to express
his views.

The big story of this game was Defense. Indy was limited by not having a running game or a professional QB, so we just teed off and shredded them. The 2nd
big story was that, from what I could see, Mac was generally uncomfortable, uncertain of himself and inaccurate. What I can't fathom are the reasons why he
looks like he does. If it's the ankle, then he needs to be replaced. If it's the protection then we need to sort that out. If it's the system and game plan then we
need to try something different, because Jones is a mess at present and has consistently looked like a guy going backwards. I keep coming back to the timing---
there are brief periods of synchronicity followed by longer stretches of disarray. His footwork looks off-kilter and his mechanics follow. I love the kid, but have to
concede that he is a total mess.

I can't say for sure, but there was one play where it appeared to me that Mac was looking Tyquan's way and expected him to adjust his route, likely a comeback, which didn't happen.
Jones had started his motion and had to stop to reset and the play failed. Shortly thereafter, he targeted Thornton again on an in-cut and threw it well behind and over the head of the
open rookie. To me, it appeared they each messed a play up, but Jones will catch blame for both. Accuracy has always been the best part of Jones' game, but even
though his completion percentage was solid at 66% -- there were a bunch of passes that were way off-target, imo. That 66 was a bit deceiving, as well, since Jones has continued
to throw short to players who are blanketed and it goes as a completion for almost no yardage.

Only Mike Onwenu seemed to play well up front. We had churn at 3 of the 5 spots and it looked it. I'll have to rewatch, but my impression was that
Cajuste played slightly better than Wynn or Cannon at RT, but gave up a near sack on a whiff block, but it's hard to focus on any single player watching live. I will say
that Yodny appeared to show better movement skills than the other guys and appears healthy, so we'll see how that goes. Let's see what Lazar says on the topic.

The offense was not close to being in synch at any point and I believe the game plan was very vanilla because Bill wasn't worried about Indy winning the game.

I think he's trying to find the best formula up front he can and save whatever wrinkles we have for the stretch run. Yes, for about the 10th year in a row I'm going with
the "Trojan Horse" theory and imagine a dynamic offense suddenly springing itself on unsuspecting opponents over the next 8 games because.......it can't possibly be
as bad as it looks. There has to be more behind the curtain.

The fans were pretty dead yesterday because the offense didn't give them a reason to get excited except for brief periods. I don't know what the attendance was but there were a lot of empty seats in my section. It did not feel like I was watching a 23-point win.

If the Pats win ugly every week I’m fine with it. Defense and dink and dunk and power run all the way.

But the OLine is a mess, agree. I think the guys they took arent busts but am not sure they should have gone LG and WR first. Major holes to fill first at DT, MLB, FS. Could have kept Karras at LG, moved Onwenu to RT and found a right guard in free agency.

Now we have a 1st round pick sitting on the bench and seeing if Wynn can play LG, while RT remains a big hole. And a 2nd round justifiably behind 5 other pass catchers
 
If the Pats win ugly every week I’m fine with it. Defense and dink and dunk and power run all the way.

But the OLine is a mess, agree. I think the guys they took arent busts but am not sure they should have gone LG and WR first. Major holes to fill first at DT, MLB, FS. Could have kept Karras at LG, moved Onwenu to RT and found a right guard in free agency.

Now we have a 1st round pick sitting on the bench and seeing if Wynn can play LG, while RT remains a big hole. And a 2nd round justifiably behind 5 other pass catchers
I don't follow your logic here. First you complain that the Oline is a mess, and then in the next sentence you say that the draft should have been used on defense.

The Pats currently have the #1 defense in the league. And maybe there are some holes in it that will be exposed against the better offenses, but I think the Oline taking primacy in last year's draft (and next year's) is the correct approach.
 
If the Pats win ugly every week I’m fine with it. Defense and dink and dunk and power run all the way.

But the OLine is a mess, agree. I think the guys they took arent busts but am not sure they should have gone LG and WR first. Major holes to fill first at DT, MLB, FS. Could have kept Karras at LG, moved Onwenu to RT and found a right guard in free agency.

Now we have a 1st round pick sitting on the bench and seeing if Wynn can play LG, while RT remains a big hole. And a 2nd round justifiably behind 5 other pass catchers
I see it as a 1st round pick playing matchups where it makes sense, and a 2nd rounder who just recently shifted into a starting role in spite of the critical time missed to injury.
You're especially off the mark on that last one. He was #2 WR in snaps last week and #3 this week, and both weeks ahead of or tied with any TE on the roster.
 
Where was the Defense ranked last year when the Bills never had to punt?
Garbage sacks vs Indianapolis colts of the world mean squat.
 
Oline is a mess, and then in the next sentence you say that the draft should have been used on defense.

Yes, and both are true.
The OLine is a mess and what they did didn’t fix it. Spent spent a valuable 1st round pick on a left guard spot where the guy is benched now and still a huge hole, when they could have just kept Karras and not traded Shaq and moved Onwenu over to RT.
Gone with:
Brown-Karras-Andrews-Shaq-Onwenu

Now it’s a mess:
Brown-Wynn-Ferentz/Andrews -Onwenu-Cajuste

Same with receiver, they already had by far the most expensive WR/TE group in the league and while Thornton seems to have potential, did not need to bring in Thornton nor Parker.

But in agreement they should go OLine in next year’s draft. Prefer it be a mid draft pick for guard and slide Onwenu to RT.
 
The Pats currently have the #1 defense in the league. And maybe there are some holes in it that will be exposed against the better offenses, but I think the Oline taking primacy in last year's draft (and next year's) is the correct approach.

I think Steve Belichick has done a great job coaching the defense via scheme and smoke and mirrors, but yes this defense has major flaws in run defense that are hard to hide against the Bills or any team with a good running game. To compete in the playoffs they need major upgrades at NT, MLB, and a future replacement for DMac at FS
 

No one should be shocked that the play calls are obvious. Hard head (Patricia) doesn't try to disguise it much. Can anyone find out what the first down run % is for the Patriots with Mac in the game? Has to be 80% or higher. Hard to be an effective offense if you only get 2 downs after getting stuffed on 1st and 10.
 
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Defenses are completely handicapped in this day and age. Burdened with so much instinct killing bullish*t they’re playing afraid. Offenses can take it to them and there is fk all they can do about it.
It’s pathetic and sad. Only vaguely resembles football.
As much as it pains me to agree with the Brady jock sniffer, in this case I must.
defenses are handicapped by rules. but scoring is down.
 
There was a guy sitting a few rows behind me at the Colts game. Every time Mac got sacked or misfired he would start
yelling Zapp-EEEE, Zapp-EEEE, Zap-EEEE!!!!!! at the top of his lungs. Nobody else chimed in and a few people heckled him. I turned around
once to see what sort of lunatic was screaming that loud and he seemed to be avoiding all interaction. Just a man on a mission to express
his views.

The big story of this game was Defense. Indy was limited by not having a running game or a professional QB, so we just teed off and shredded them. The 2nd
big story was that, from what I could see, Mac was generally uncomfortable, uncertain of himself and inaccurate. What I can't fathom are the reasons why he
looks like he does. If it's the ankle, then he needs to be replaced. If it's the protection then we need to sort that out. If it's the system and game plan then we
need to try something different, because Jones is a mess at present and has consistently looked like a guy going backwards. I keep coming back to the timing---
there are brief periods of synchronicity followed by longer stretches of disarray. His footwork looks off-kilter and his mechanics follow. I love the kid, but have to
concede that he is a total mess.

I can't say for sure, but there was one play where it appeared to me that Mac was looking Tyquan's way and expected him to adjust his route, likely a comeback, which didn't happen.
Jones had started his motion and had to stop to reset and the play failed. Shortly thereafter, he targeted Thornton again on an in-cut and threw it well behind and over the head of the
open rookie. To me, it appeared they each messed a play up, but Jones will catch blame for both. Accuracy has always been the best part of Jones' game, but even
though his completion percentage was solid at 66% -- there were a bunch of passes that were way off-target, imo. That 66 was a bit deceiving, as well, since Jones has continued
to throw short to players who are blanketed and it goes as a completion for almost no yardage.

Only Mike Onwenu seemed to play well up front. We had churn at 3 of the 5 spots and it looked it. I'll have to rewatch, but my impression was that
Cajuste played slightly better than Wynn or Cannon at RT, but gave up a near sack on a whiff block, but it's hard to focus on any single player watching live. I will say
that Yodny appeared to show better movement skills than the other guys and appears healthy, so we'll see how that goes. Let's see what Lazar says on the topic.

The offense was not close to being in synch at any point and I believe the game plan was very vanilla because Bill wasn't worried about Indy winning the game.

I think he's trying to find the best formula up front he can and save whatever wrinkles we have for the stretch run. Yes, for about the 10th year in a row I'm going with
the "Trojan Horse" theory and imagine a dynamic offense suddenly springing itself on unsuspecting opponents over the next 8 games because.......it can't possibly be
as bad as it looks. There has to be more behind the curtain.

The fans were pretty dead yesterday because the offense didn't give them a reason to get excited except for brief periods. I don't know what the attendance was but there were a lot of empty seats in my section. It did not feel like I was watching a 23-point win.
Very worrying to hear about the fans. The fans took a lot of flack after the Bears game for chanting Zappe"s name but there's a reason many fans feel this way. Zappe gave them something to cheer, simple as. Fans liked what they saw with his movement in the pocket, his vision and the spread of receivers used. He brought a buzz to that offense. It can't be denied. We all love Mac, but he's not mentally there at the moment. There is no way this is not worrying Bill and co.
 
defenses are handicapped by rules. but scoring is down.
Pendulum has swung so much toward the passing offense that all over the league teams are sitting back in a 2-deep shell, closing off the big plays, and daring offenses to beat them with the run and/or dink and dunk without mistakes.

Running attacks that would be above average or very good even 5 or 10 years ago appear to be unstoppable juggernauts - e.g. TEN, CLE.
 
Where was the Defense ranked last year when the Bills never had to punt?
Garbage sacks vs Indianapolis colts of the world mean squat.
This defense is OK. They're still not elite. I don't care what anyone says. But, the defense isn't the problem. The problem is offensive coordinator/coaching, the oline, and the QB. Oh, and the punter. He should have never been re-signed. Terrible decision on BB's part.
 
I know there are plenty of Zappe / Mac fanatics around these days, each championing their man to be starter. But even the biggest Mac homer must admit that his current play doesn't pass the eyeball test. We watched Tom struggle behind bad OLs in the past, and there's a clear different between an elite QB playing behind a bad OL and an average QB struggling within himself.

Not that Mac should be compared to Brady, but it's obvious just from watching the game that something isn't clicking with him and the offense. He looks uncomfortable all the time. He made a couple of nice throws yesterday, but also a number of bad ones and missed reads.

I don't know enough Xs and Os to know the solution ... but I don't feel like I'm watching a stud ready to break out from his slumber. I feel like I'm watching a rookie trying to navigate the pro game on a bad team, which isn't great given he's well into his 2nd year now.

Agreed. The “Mac is our QB” hype needs a pause, because he has been downright mediocre. Perhaps it was the injury and O-line, but a lot is on him too. He doesn’t look right.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
 
Agreed. The “Mac is our QB” hype needs a pause, because he has been downright mediocre. Perhaps it was the injury and O-line, but a lot is on him too. He doesn’t look right.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

Shitty game plans, shitty O line play and an unfortunate injury maaaaaaaay have a tendency to impact a QB's play, don't you think?
 
It's really too bad that we lost yesterday, I thought that we had a good chance for a win.
Games only count as wins when the offense is dominant.

It is only old farts like me that enjoy games where defense and special teams put on a show.
 
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