2021 draft. Round 1 pick 15 Patriots select QB Mac Jones!

Excellent

 

I know...being a bouncybuccaneer fan can be really challenging and all...but, Pats fans can actually succeed sans TFB. It might be sobering howevèr...

You are comparing Jones to Montana and Brady and I am bouncy? LOL Maybe put down the Kool aide just a little ...

 

You are comparing Jones to Montana and Brady and I am bouncy? LOL Maybe put down the Kool aide just a little ...

I agree...you should! Finally!

 

Trevor was everyone's #1. I said that Jones was my #5 of the 5 QBs. Still, I am very happy we came away with one of them and we did not have to trade up either.

When I talk about Mac Jones skill set, I am not talking about him being a dual threat passer and runner. I could care less about that although it is nice to have a more athletic guy that can escape the pocket from time to time and pick up a first down with his legs like a Rodgers.

Jones is not a QB that can create on his own and make plays happen. In other words, he is not going to elevate those around him. They will have to elevate him. Alabama was the most stacked team - 2 of their receivers went last night in the top 10 and both were trade ups to get them. He has good pocket presence, supposedly is very cerebral which I don't doubt and has a decent arm. I get those are all traits the Pats like mostly because of Brady but you will really have to look long and hard at today's NFL landscape to see if that is really the type of QB and offense you want to run to compete with the Bills and Chiefs.

NFL offenses have morphed to college friendly styles with tons of misdirection, motions and most of all speed. Our offense is not predicated on any of that especially now that we have gone TE and RB heavy which I actually think is the right approach with a rookie QB to start but my fear is because of Jones skillset or lack thereof, we are going to stay with this antiquated offense and not be able to keep up with the likes of the Bills and Chiefs. We have to be dynamic to compete. We can't just plod along. It won't be good enough with the ways things are trending in the league especially with the rules that make the passing game almost criminally easy.

All that being said, I like Jones persona. I loved the way he strutted down the hallway when he was picked. He certainly seems to have the right attitude to compete and hopefully win the starting job this year. I just hope Bill is not so married to Cam that he does not give him a chance. We drafted him at 15 for a reason - to play now.

How can you possibly know that? He hasn't taken a single snap in this league. I'm surprised at your take on this. There was a QB years ago at Michigan who didn't exactly set the college world on fire and nobody seemed to want him in the draft. Yet he worked out OK. Mac doesn't have the shiny bells and whistles but he's accurate, clever, quick thinking and led his team to a championship under Nick Saban and that's not an easy thing to do.

 

How can you possibly know that? He hasn't taken a single snap in this league. I'm surprised at your take on this. There was a QB years ago at Michigan who didn't exactly set the college world on fire and nobody seemed to want him in the draft. Yet he worked out OK. Mac doesn't have the shiny bells and whistles but he's accurate, clever, quick thinking and led his team to a championship under Nick Saban and that's not an easy thing to do.

I am basing it on his college career, albeit it was limited. You really have to stop with the Brady comparisons. If that is the fanbase expectation, we are all going to be manic depressives. I do like his traits and his attitude, I am just hoping for a solid starter that can stay healthy and pick up the offense. I realize it is the day after and all, but these expectations are insane.

 

Ah well. Mazz has given the definitive verdict everyone. Jones hasn't taken a single snap in the NFL yet but already he's been confined to a decent but not great player.

Ah well. Better luck next time Bill.

 

I am basing it on his college career, albeit it was limited. You really have to stop with the Brady comparisons. If that is the fanbase expectation, we are all going to be manic depressives. I do like his traits and his attitude, I am just hoping for a solid starter that can stay healthy and pick up the offense. I realize it is the day after and all, but these expectations are insane.

Yeah, I’m sure you watched a whole lot of Alabama games, in between your watching Bucs’ replays.

Let’s call a spade a spade; you’re still hoping for the Bucs to do better than the Patriots .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

Well, I wanted him, thought that they would not be able to get him, and he fell straight into BB's lap. While I disagree with Mazz's assessment, I also think that as Bill Parcells once said we should put a hold on enshrining him into the hall of fame just yet.

 

Yeah, I think many of us are getting a little ahead of ourselves. This is a great fit and it's starkly similar to the old QB in terms of play style/traits, but he needs to actually play to see if he will translate to the NFL. For now he'll sit and learn behind Cam. After that, sky is the limit.

 

Nobody is expecting him to be a Tom Brady. Nobody will ever get to that level again. We know this.

From what we can see of him, the great postseason with Bama, the fact that Saban and BB are very tight and Bill relies hugely on Saban in these evaluations, and that we have a QB who is mentally strong, poised and accurate is a good thing. We don't know how he'll fare in the NFL, nobody does. We can only go on what we have seen in college. The fundamentals do seem positive and with a good cast of offensive weapons, there is great potential for this offense now. Let's give the kid some room and not write him off nor enshrine him yet. Looooong way to go before we see him taking on NFL calibre defenses.

Pretty wild we have two Auburn and an Alabama QB now!

 

I won 2 rounds of beers. For correctly picking Jones for my Gettysburg trip. Maybe he can help improve Newton accuracy & mechanics.

 

Yeah, I think many of us are getting a little ahead of ourselves. This is a great fit and it's starkly similar to the old QB in terms of play style/traits, but he needs to actually play to see if he will translate to the NFL. For now he'll sit and learn behind Cam. After that, sky is the limit.

It feels like when we drafted Bledsoe to me. I was pretty happy then, and pretty happy now. I think Drew would have done better if he was in our current system, so my expectation is for Mac to be Bledsoe version 2.0 with better success thean the first version.

 

I am basing it on his college career, albeit it was limited. You really have to stop with the Brady comparisons.

Saying that a drafted QB will be in the NFL what he was in college and no more is pretty dumb. Many players picked high bust and some players picked late surpass all expectations. To look at an NCAA QB and say he cannot make thing happen or elevate players around him.

The Brady comparison is this: No one, NO ONE, knows how a player will do in the NFL based on what he did in college. As you said a zillion times, a first round QB pick is likely to do better than a late round pick, but there are QBs who exceeding expectations.

You just can't say who a QB is until he plays in the NFL. You don't like Jones. I liked him from the start. Truth. Go back and reda the draft thread. Both are opinions, only that. But to say he can't make plays or elevate at team because of his skillset (not mobile, reads defenses well, processes information quickly/makes quick decisions, is accurate) while slurping over Brady is disengenuous. You assume a pair of WRs elevated thir QB while adamantly denying it is impossible for a QB to elevate his WRs merely shows your desperate need to not have the Pats do well post-Brady. Either is possible, but IMO it is more likely a good QB is more likely to elevate his WRs than the other way around.

As for the idea that a non-mobile QB cannot win in today's NFL and cannot compete against a supermobile QB like the Chiefs have, I invite you to watch a replay of the last superbowl.

Geez Louise, give it a rest. The Pats signed WRs, TEs, and run stuffers in free agency, and picked a first round QB, the one that best best matched their style of play. How can you not be excited about their prospects????? Cripes, you make Midgar look like a Pats homer.

Trevor was everyone's #1. I said that Jones was my #5 of the 5 QBs. Still, I am very happy we came away with one of them and we did not have to trade up either.

When I talk about Mac Jones skill set, I am not talking about him being a dual threat passer and runner. I could care less about that although it is nice to have a more athletic guy that can escape the pocket from time to time and pick up a first down with his legs like a Rodgers.

Jones is not a QB that can create on his own and make plays happen. In other words, he is not going to elevate those around him. They will have to elevate him. Alabama was the most stacked team - 2 of their receivers went last night in the top 10 and both were trade ups to get them. He has good pocket presence, supposedly is very cerebral which I don't doubt and has a decent arm. I get those are all traits the Pats like mostly because of Brady but you will really have to look long and hard at today's NFL landscape to see if that is really the type of QB and offense you want to run to compete with the Bills and Chiefs.

NFL offenses have morphed to college friendly styles with tons of misdirection, motions and most of all speed. Our offense is not predicated on any of that especially now that we have gone TE and RB heavy which I actually think is the right approach with a rookie QB to start but my fear is because of Jones skillset or lack thereof, we are going to stay with this antiquated offense and not be able to keep up with the likes of the Bills and Chiefs. We have to be dynamic to compete. We can't just plod along. It won't be good enough with the ways things are trending in the league especially with the rules that make the passing game almost criminally easy.

All that being said, I like Jones persona. I loved the way he strutted down the hallway when he was picked. He certainly seems to have the right attitude to compete and hopefully win the starting job this year. I just hope Bill is not so married to Cam that he does not give him a chance. We drafted him at 15 for a reason - to play now.

I got a chuckle out of the bolded red passage.

 

It feels like when we drafted Bledsoe to me. I was pretty happy then, and pretty happy now. I think Drew would have done better if he was in our current system, so my expectation is for Mac to be Bledsoe version 2.0 with better success thean the first version.

I loved Bledsoe. His only crime was trying too hard to make a play and being unwilling to throw the ball away.

 

Trevor was everyone's #1. I said that Jones was my #5 of the 5 QBs. Still, I am very happy we came away with one of them and we did not have to trade up either.

When I talk about Mac Jones skill set, I am not talking about him being a dual threat passer and runner. I could care less about that although it is nice to have a more athletic guy that can escape the pocket from time to time and pick up a first down with his legs like a Rodgers.

Jones is not a QB that can create on his own and make plays happen. In other words, he is not going to elevate those around him. They will have to elevate him. Alabama was the most stacked team - 2 of their receivers went last night in the top 10 and both were trade ups to get them. He has good pocket presence, supposedly is very cerebral which I don't doubt and has a decent arm. I get those are all traits the Pats like mostly because of Brady but you will really have to look long and hard at today's NFL landscape to see if that is really the type of QB and offense you want to run to compete with the Bills and Chiefs.

NFL offenses have morphed to college friendly styles with tons of misdirection, motions and most of all speed. Our offense is not predicated on any of that especially now that we have gone TE and RB heavy which I actually think is the right approach with a rookie QB to start but my fear is because of Jones skillset or lack thereof, we are going to stay with this antiquated offense and not be able to keep up with the likes of the Bills and Chiefs. We have to be dynamic to compete. We can't just plod along. It won't be good enough with the ways things are trending in the league especially with the rules that make the passing game almost criminally easy.

All that being said, I like Jones persona. I loved the way he strutted down the hallway when he was picked. He certainly seems to have the right attitude to compete and hopefully win the starting job this year. I just hope Bill is not so married to Cam that he does not give him a chance. We drafted him at 15 for a reason - to play now.

Jones is not a QB that can create on his own and make plays happen. In other words, he is not going to elevate those around him.
This is a classic non sequitur. TFB doesn't make plays on his own; he distributes the ball with good decisions and accurate passes. Yet TB is well known to elevate those around him.

I suggest you study up on the Erhardt-Perkins Offensive System so you know wtf you're talking about.

The Erhardt-Perkins system.

The Erndhart-Perkins sytem was developed in the 1970s by Ray Perkins and Ron Ernhardt who were coaching for the New England Patriots under head coach Chuck Fairbanks. That trio of coaches did fairly well in New England, but their system has been thrust into the spotlight by the success of another Patriots coach: Bill Belichick.

At this point we all know who Belichick and Tom Brady are and what they’ve done. They’re arguably the best QB-Coach combo in NFL history. But on their way to all those Super Bowls they have set records by being essentially playbook chameleons.

One year they were spreading the field with 4 WR and throwing it to Randy Moss and Wes Welker, fast forward a few years and they were running 2 TE sets with Gronk and Hernandez (obligatory note here that Hernandez was an extremely troubled individual and convicted murderer, which is bad) or 2 back sets with Ridley or Vereen or Woodhead or Kevan Faulk, or whichever successful backs they happened to have.

The Patriots offense was built to do seemingly anything that would give the opposing defense the most trouble. And it was built that way from the language-up.

The backbone of the Erhardt-Perkins system is that plays — pass plays in particular — are not organized by a route tree or by calling a single receiver’s route, but by what coaches refer to as “concepts.” Each play has a name, and that name conjures up an image for both the quarterback and the other players on offense. And, most importantly, the concept can be called from almost any formation or set. Who does what changes, but the theory and tactics driving the play do not. “In essence, you’re running the same play,” said Perkins. “You’re just giving them some window-dressing to make it look different.”

The biggest advantage of the concept-based system is that it operates from the perspective of the most critical player on offense: the quarterback. In other systems, even if the underlying principles are the exact same, the play and its name might be very different. Rather than juggling all this information in real time, an Erhardt-Perkins quarterback only has to read a given arrangement of receivers. “You can cut down on the plays and get different looks from your formations and who’s in them. It’s easier for the players to learn. It’s easier for the quarterback to learn,” former Patriots offensive coordinator Charlie Weis said back in 2000. “You get different looks without changing his reads. You don’t need an open-ended number of plays.”

This simplicity is one of the reasons coaches around the league have been gravitating to the Erhardt-Perkins approach. “Concepts benefit you because you can plug different guys into different formations, into different personnel groups, and if they understand the concept, it gives you more flexibility,” Atlanta Falcons offensive coordinator Dirk Koetter recently explained. “The number system restricts you because it doesn’t allow you to cover all the combinations you want to use, so you have to get into so many tags that eventually you’re calling everybody’s route. In route concepts, one word can describe anything. In my experience, most kids can visualize one-word concepts better.”

» Speak My Language

grantland.com

Two Concepts in One: The Erhardt Perkins Playcalling Language

So far in this series on playcalling languages, we’ve looked at the language structures of the Coryell, West Coast, and Air Raid offenses. Today we’ll be looking at the last NFL language: the...

www.dawgsbynature.com

 

I'm rewatching the QB School episodes on Mac, just refinished the first one, and while it isn't perfect there is alot to like. Ignoring the couple where the D just got beat because of better athletes outside/concepts, he has some really tight window throws, makes the right read, and had super solid mechanics......those things lessen the chance he will bust. It will really come down to learning the system, and executing at the NFL level.

Here is the first episode of (I think) 5.


View: https://youtu.be/OgL0w0O5is8

 

LOL tons of draftniks had him going third to SF but since he fell to us he sucks, got it.

 

Seems to me that BB is building a team similar to 20 years ago. Predicated on defense and a running game while a young accurate quick reading and decision making QB manages the team as he learns the ropes. Just sayin.

Oh and edit. He is not slow. He can run for yards if the play breaks down or if the D gives them to him. He also knows how to manage and move within the pocket. Take a breath.

 

I am basing it on his college career, albeit it was limited. You really have to stop with the Brady comparisons. If that is the fanbase expectation, we are all going to be manic depressives. I do like his traits and his attitude, I am just hoping for a solid starter that can stay healthy and pick up the offense. I realize it is the day after and all, but these expectations are insane.

I was wondering why the pessimism. Now I get it.

 

Ack! C'mon, they could have traded back, picked up a 3rd, and still gotten him!

 

» Speak My Language

grantland.com

Two Concepts in One: The Erhardt Perkins Playcalling Language

So far in this series on playcalling languages, we’ve looked at the language structures of the Coryell, West Coast, and Air Raid offenses. Today we’ll be looking at the last NFL language: the...

www.dawgsbynature.com

These were great, thanks chevss!
one thing i am not sure i get is i've heard the O is hard to learn; hence, ocho et. al. struggling with it. but some of the comments from your post that i cut out are that it simplifies things. so does that mean it's hard to learn the concepts married with what they indicate but once they are learned, things are simplified from the playcall vs. what to execute perspective? or what?